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Old 07-19-2017, 10:41 AM   #505
Steve Lai
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Hey guys. Good to reach and read this thread. Would like to share some experience with u.
I got a water pump leakage last month in my '12 GTI DSG at 45K KM. My mechanic charged US $250 for labour. I asked for concurrent carbon clean up since the IM would be lifted up, but he refused and advised me to pour several cans of eng clearner instead.
I decided to DIY & hv the pump replaced, a full clean up of carbon built up in valves as well as a thorough injectors cleaning.
The carbon deposit is awful coz we seldom hv chance to pull the car over 3500 rpm in Hong Kong. I'm gratifying that mechanic refused the carbon cleaning job which has triggered me to try out the DIY - such a rewarding experience indeed, though it took me weeks of research and 2 days of engine bay battle but definitely worth it.
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Old 10-05-2017, 09:41 PM   #506
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If this is not the correct place, let me know; but I am going to start this from the "Other End", as it were.

I have a 2010 [Stock] GTI w/133,000 miles on it. (Bought used this past May) Drive it combo city/highway about 35 min each way to work & back. No obvious symptoms of carbon buildup issues yet. Car runs great. Almost can't tell it's running when at idle. Accelerates smoothly.

I have been noticing quite a bit of carbon buildup on the tailpipes. Comes off on your finger, so it's fresh. Does this indicate anything related to the original topic of this thread? I run 93 octane. Run Top Tier every 4th fill up, and try to do a carbon cleaning run every month or so. No oil burning at all. Looks clean, too. The tailpipe thing is puzzling. It's not a diesel...

I am told this is "normal" for a GTI. Is it really? (Price we pay for DI & the quality of the "gas" we buy?)

Could it be style of driving? I have noticed more of a tailpipe build-up since I started letting the DSG do all the heavy work of shifting, instead of using manual-mode. My overall mileage is up; but am I sabotaging myself for carbon buildup at the intake valves, and the tailpipe buildup is just an indication of that?

Or may this be related to the chain tensioner failure I had 3500 miles ago, and the bad chain cover seal that puked oil for quite a while before I caught it? Could that cause a carbon buildup at the tailpipes? I lost some 2 quarts of oil in ~800 miles before I caught the leak, but almost nothing ended up on the ground. (Not sure where it went, unless on the windscreen of the poor guy driving behind me?)

Anyway - I'm wondering what kind of an issue it might (or might not) be.

Thanks!
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Old 10-05-2017, 10:43 PM   #507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTIKage View Post
If this is not the correct place, let me know; but I am going to start this from the "Other End", as it were.

I have a 2010 [Stock] GTI w/133,000 miles on it. (Bought used this past May) Drive it combo city/highway about 35 min each way to work & back. No obvious symptoms of carbon buildup issues yet. Car runs great. Almost can't tell it's running when at idle. Accelerates smoothly.

I have been noticing quite a bit of carbon buildup on the tailpipes. Comes off on your finger, so it's fresh. Does this indicate anything related to the original topic of this thread? I run 93 octane. Run Top Tier every 4th fill up, and try to do a carbon cleaning run every month or so. No oil burning at all. Looks clean, too. The tailpipe thing is puzzling. It's not a diesel...

I am told this is "normal" for a GTI. Is it really? (Price we pay for DI & the quality of the "gas" we buy?)

Could it be style of driving? I have noticed more of a tailpipe build-up since I started letting the DSG do all the heavy work of shifting, instead of using manual-mode. My overall mileage is up; but am I sabotaging myself for carbon buildup at the intake valves, and the tailpipe buildup is just an indication of that?

Or may this be related to the chain tensioner failure I had 3500 miles ago, and the bad chain cover seal that puked oil for quite a while before I caught it? Could that cause a carbon buildup at the tailpipes? I lost some 2 quarts of oil in ~800 miles before I caught the leak, but almost nothing ended up on the ground. (Not sure where it went, unless on the windscreen of the poor guy driving behind me?)

Anyway - I'm wondering what kind of an issue it might (or might not) be.

Thanks!

The carbon build up is normal with DI engines. Hopefully at that mileage you already had at least one carbon cleaning. From what it seems that driving manual mode or “drive” mode carbon build up is inevitable. Catch cans and meth injection help slow it down.



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Old 10-30-2017, 12:42 AM   #508
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https://www.jcmmachineandcoatings.com/coatings/valves/

Ran across this...maybe it would help, maybe not.
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Old 10-30-2017, 03:35 AM   #509
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Thanks for the simple explanation, my hungry noob brain is grateful.
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Old 11-03-2017, 05:44 PM   #510
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Originally Posted by hbrown0509 View Post
The carbon build up is normal with DI engines. Hopefully at that mileage you already had at least one carbon cleaning. From what it seems that driving manual mode or “drive” mode carbon build up is inevitable. Catch cans and meth injection help slow it down.



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"Catch cans and meth injection help slow it down. "

There is no proof of this.
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Old 11-03-2017, 07:09 PM   #511
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Originally Posted by fredf View Post
"Catch cans and meth injection help slow it down. "

There is no proof of this.
Accurate statement. Unless you pull the manifold off dozens of times to measure there is no good measurement of this.

Particularly because alot of people dont know how exactly it forms. Some people say its oil residue in the intake track... some say hyper rich gas/carbon that deposit on the valve as the engine is turned off.

Methanol is a solvent so that should help... but really only if youre pouring TONS of meth into the cyc which then would not be helping with combustion. If you run meth like i do where it is just a cooling point than really youre not getting any of that junk off the valve.



Catch cans dont make any sense to me on these cars. Literally a waste of 400 bucks unless you have bombed your PCV system
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Old 11-03-2017, 09:23 PM   #512
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Originally Posted by Injen1us View Post
Accurate statement. Unless you pull the manifold off dozens of times to measure there is no good measurement of this.

Particularly because alot of people dont know how exactly it forms. Some people say its oil residue in the intake track... some say hyper rich gas/carbon that deposit on the valve as the engine is turned off.

Methanol is a solvent so that should help... but really only if youre pouring TONS of meth into the cyc which then would not be helping with combustion. If you run meth like i do where it is just a cooling point than really youre not getting any of that junk off the valve.



Catch cans dont make any sense to me on these cars. Literally a waste of 400 bucks unless you have bombed your PCV system
It's proven that meth can help with valves that are already cleaned, but it does basically nothing to them once dirty.
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Old 11-03-2017, 10:58 PM   #513
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It's proven that meth can help with valves that are already cleaned, but it does basically nothing to them once dirty.


Meth with also help with any pesky teeth...


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Old 11-04-2017, 08:56 AM   #514
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Someone did a comparison of how much a catch can affects carbon build up. The before and after affects. The conclusion was that there was no real impact. IIRC there are only 2 things that help with carbon build up.

1) Water/Meth
2) Drive the car hard regularly.

I did my carbon cleaning around 80k miles or so and i had minimal build up.
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Old 11-04-2017, 10:55 AM   #515
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Carbon Buildup 101

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dans GTI View Post
Someone did a comparison of how much a catch can affects carbon build up. The before and after affects. The conclusion was that there was no real impact. IIRC there are only 2 things that help with carbon build up.

1) Water/Meth
2) Drive the car hard regularly.

I did my carbon cleaning around 80k miles or so and i had minimal build up.


But I thought there is no proof of water/ meth slowing it down as I was told earlier lol. I’m joking of course lol.



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Old 11-04-2017, 11:01 AM   #516
hbrown0509
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Originally Posted by fredf View Post
"Catch cans and meth injection help slow it down. "



There is no proof of this.


I meant to say “may help slow it down.”

I already know that once the valves are dirty the only way to get it off is by manual cleaning. Clean valves with water/meth will slow it down or additional port fuel injection like Audi started doing.


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Old 11-04-2017, 01:15 PM   #517
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Carbon Buildup 101

Quote:
Originally Posted by Injen1us View Post
Accurate statement. Unless you pull the manifold off dozens of times to measure there is no good measurement of this.



Particularly because alot of people dont know how exactly it forms. Some people say its oil residue in the intake track... some say hyper rich gas/carbon that deposit on the valve as the engine is turned off.



Methanol is a solvent so that should help... but really only if youre pouring TONS of meth into the cyc which then would not be helping with combustion. If you run meth like i do where it is just a cooling point than really youre not getting any of that junk off the valve.







Catch cans dont make any sense to me on these cars. Literally a waste of 400 bucks unless you have bombed your PCV system


I thought the point of catch cans were to collect blow by and reduce it going back into the intake track for better combustion purposes and reducing the diluting of the engine oil over time with fuel and water condensation? I just didn’t like all the blow-by-oil pooling in the charge pipe and going into the intercooler. Just curious your opinion why they don’t make sense to you on these cars?


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Old 11-04-2017, 02:51 PM   #518
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Originally Posted by hbrown0509 View Post
I thought the point of catch cans were to collect blow by and reduce it going back into the intake track for better combustion purposes and reducing the diluting of the engine oil over time with fuel and water condensation? I just didn’t like all the blow-by-oil pooling in the charge pipe and going into the intercooler. Just curious your opinion why they don’t make sense to you on these cars?


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That's exactly what they do. Some people say that it is a contributor to carbon build up too. That part I'm not so sure.

The reason I don't think they make sense on these cars is because I measure it often.

Everytime someone says: "look at how much gunk I pulled out of my catch can! And in only 5k miles!" And they hold up a 12 ounce water bottle and expect that to sell me. But if you break it down (and I have a half dozen times) the engine consumes about 1/2ml of oil every mile...

I'm not sure if you can visualize a ml... But it's basically 1/3 of a penny. Now quarter that... Now that is how much is consumed in the avg mile.

Insignificant. Your engine won't know the difference
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