GOLFMK7
GOLFMK6
GOLFMKV
VW GTI MKVI Forum / VW Golf R Forum / VW Golf MKVI Forum / VW GTI Forum - Golfmk6.com



Go Back   VW GTI MKVI Forum / VW Golf R Forum / VW Golf MKVI Forum / VW GTI Forum - Golfmk6.com > Technical Topics > GTI 2.0T Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust / Tunes


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-16-2013, 04:18 PM   #141
Thumper
Formula 3000 Driver
 
Thumper's Avatar
 
Drives: 15 Audi S3/'15 Audi S4/'15 328dx SW
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Evans, CO
Posts: 3,477
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilfleck View Post
What's wrong with reusing OEM parts? As someone else mentioned, it's based off the OEM design. I don't think a few OEM bolts are the cause or affecting disc failures...
Eactly, the OEM clutches are slipping not exploding. Before any blame for an aftermarket using a design based off the OEM causing issues is doled out there is one important factor that must be addressed which isn't.

What part of the OEM design is the flaw? Is it the pressure plate? The flywheel? The friction disc?

I've said it before and I will say it again and I will continue to say it; this issue does not have a simple 1 answer solution. If the weak point was the pressure plate then people putting in a drop in disc would not be getting results. If it is the flywheel then how come there are people who are keeping the OEM flywheel and not having problems??

And as always I revert back to the same statistical fact.......OEM clutches are not all failing at the same point and the same power levels. Stock car on stock clutch fails at 9000 miles meanwhile you could have a Stage 2 car running the stock clutch for 30,000 miles.

There is clearly more than one issue going on here and it goes past bolt and spring design.
__________________
2012 GTI 4dr Black Pearl 6spd w/Xenons - Check out my Build thread "The Wraith" - SOLD
2015 Misano Red S3 w/Sport Pack
2015 Sepang Blue S4 S-Tronic | ADS
2015 Alpine White BMW 328dX Touring M-Sport

Last edited by Thumper; 01-16-2013 at 04:29 PM.
Thumper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 04:48 PM   #142
Mustache rash
Formula 5000 Champion
 
Mustache rash's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 K04 GTI 6mt
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,274
Aftermarket clutch kits are oem but not for our application.

Again referencing this thread:
http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33625

Stock disc have a floating spline carrier that can compensate for axial misalignment.
This is why the springs pop out.
__________________

2011 CSG GTI 6MT
APR K04 3.1
Build Thread
IG@mustache_rash
Mustache rash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:32 PM   #143
XGC75
Formula 1 Driver
 
XGC75's Avatar
 
Drives: into shit
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 9,350
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustache rash View Post
Aftermarket clutch kits are oem but not for our application.

Again referencing this thread:
http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33625

Stock disc have a floating spline carrier that can compensate for axial misalignment.
This is why the springs pop out.
You said earlier that where one supplier might be faulty (ie southbend), if the other supplier uses the same design methodology (borrow from OEM) then it should be put under the same scrutiny. I think this is a key issue.

Any clutch gurus out there (Dave or Mike) care to comment on specific design features that might differentiate a particular product? For example, if it is the spline carrier that fails in Southend (pre-revision) units, how does your product do it better?

butchered by autocorrect
XGC75 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:44 PM   #144
lilfleck
Moderator
 
Drives: '11 GTI Autobahn, DSG
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,113
Quote:
Originally Posted by XGC75 View Post
You said earlier that where one supplier might be faulty (ie southbend), if the other supplier uses the same design methodology (borrow from OEM) then it should be put under the same scrutiny. I think this is a key issue.

Any clutch gurus out there (Dave or Mike) care to comment on specific design features that might differentiate a particular product? For example, if it is the spline carrier that fails in Southend (pre-revision) units, how does your product do it better?

butchered by autocorrect
Thicker springs should stay in there better. More support around the edges perhaps.

CM FX350:


Southbend Stage 2 Daily:


Revised Southbend Disc by Exedy:




SACHS OEM+ (the way it should be IMO):
lilfleck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:47 PM   #145
lilfleck
Moderator
 
Drives: '11 GTI Autobahn, DSG
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,113
Added that info to my thread on my clutch research:
http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52388
lilfleck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:50 PM   #146
MaliciousMK6
Formula 3000 Driver
 
MaliciousMK6's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 Tornado Red 2Dr 6MT GTI
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 3,332
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilfleck View Post
Added that info to my thread on my clutch research:
http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52388
Good info!
MaliciousMK6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:51 PM   #147
realcyberbob
Formula 5000 Driver
 
realcyberbob's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 GTI
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Osaka / Houston
Posts: 1,590
Send a message via AIM to realcyberbob
Stock clutch disc for reference:

I have more pictures of the stock setup in my thread as well: http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51717
__________________
2011 CW GTI 6-Speed: APR Stage II, APR Carbonio Intake, Clutch Masters FX350 Clutch Kit, 42nd Draft Designs Downpipe, Magnaflow Catback Exhaust, Forge Twintercooler, BFG DV+, Dieselgeek Short Shifter, ECS Dogbone Mount Insert, StopTech Pads & Slotted Rotors, Tyrolsport Brake Stiffening Kit, Golf R LED Tail Lights, CiM Vent Boost Gauge, RNS-510 Navigation, Uber-Stealth Box & 10" Pioneer Sub, Alpine MRP-M500 Amp, 25th Ann. GTI Golfball Shift Knob, Modshack Low Profile Engine Bay Trim, Hankook V12
realcyberbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:52 PM   #148
APRMK6GTi
Formula 5000 Champion
 
APRMK6GTi's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 GTI
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 2,760
man those are some beefy springs in the SACHS OEM+
__________________
2012 CSG GTI 6SPD | APR Tuned | AWE K04 | APR Carbonio | IE FDS IC | 42DD DP | Magnaflow CBE | Neuspeed TOP/ACP | GFB DV+ | DG S6 | Fluidampr| OEM MSB | Verdict SBB | HST RSR | ECS Bleeder Block | SuperPro LCA/ALK | 034 TAI | AST/GC | OZ | TT-RS Brakes | Whiteline 24MM F&R | Tyrolsport | Unibrace XB/UB/RB | EuroSport LB | Euro OEM LED | OEM Aero | P3 |
Nor Cal VW Drivers Club
APRMK6GTi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:56 PM   #149
lilfleck
Moderator
 
Drives: '11 GTI Autobahn, DSG
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,113
Quote:
Originally Posted by APRMK6GTi View Post
man those are some beefy springs in the SACHS OEM+
No lie... you know its solid quality. It's just not very affordable.
lilfleck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 05:59 PM   #150
Mustache rash
Formula 5000 Champion
 
Mustache rash's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 K04 GTI 6mt
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,274
Wow this thread just got good!!!!!!
__________________

2011 CSG GTI 6MT
APR K04 3.1
Build Thread
IG@mustache_rash
Mustache rash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 06:13 PM   #151
lilfleck
Moderator
 
Drives: '11 GTI Autobahn, DSG
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustache rash View Post
Wow this thread just got good!!!!!!
FWIW, I have taken all the interesting bits that I have found on this forum on clutches and put it in the OP of this thread, http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52388
lilfleck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 06:24 PM   #152
APRMK6GTi
Formula 5000 Champion
 
APRMK6GTi's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 GTI
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 2,760
how much does the OEM Sach+ go for? Is it like $1600+?
__________________
2012 CSG GTI 6SPD | APR Tuned | AWE K04 | APR Carbonio | IE FDS IC | 42DD DP | Magnaflow CBE | Neuspeed TOP/ACP | GFB DV+ | DG S6 | Fluidampr| OEM MSB | Verdict SBB | HST RSR | ECS Bleeder Block | SuperPro LCA/ALK | 034 TAI | AST/GC | OZ | TT-RS Brakes | Whiteline 24MM F&R | Tyrolsport | Unibrace XB/UB/RB | EuroSport LB | Euro OEM LED | OEM Aero | P3 |
Nor Cal VW Drivers Club
APRMK6GTi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 06:29 PM   #153
lilfleck
Moderator
 
Drives: '11 GTI Autobahn, DSG
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,113
Quote:
Originally Posted by APRMK6GTi View Post
how much does the OEM Sach+ go for? Is it like $1600+?
1800+shipping i think.
lilfleck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2013, 06:31 PM   #154
APRMK6GTi
Formula 5000 Champion
 
APRMK6GTi's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 GTI
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 2,760
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilfleck View Post
1800+shipping i think.
o crap, that is expensive....+ install thats over 2gs
__________________
2012 CSG GTI 6SPD | APR Tuned | AWE K04 | APR Carbonio | IE FDS IC | 42DD DP | Magnaflow CBE | Neuspeed TOP/ACP | GFB DV+ | DG S6 | Fluidampr| OEM MSB | Verdict SBB | HST RSR | ECS Bleeder Block | SuperPro LCA/ALK | 034 TAI | AST/GC | OZ | TT-RS Brakes | Whiteline 24MM F&R | Tyrolsport | Unibrace XB/UB/RB | EuroSport LB | Euro OEM LED | OEM Aero | P3 |
Nor Cal VW Drivers Club
APRMK6GTi is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.