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HPA vs. UM Haldex controllers.

Bryan259

Ready to race!
What's the difference between

Tq transfer vs stock. Also I'm confused as to when braking is applied if I have abs/ecs vagcom delete if that will affect tq transfer. Anyone done testing on skid pads of dyno graphs that can show and explain what I'm looking at. I've seen them online but they are convoluded.

HPA 3 mode (race)

HPA Comp controller

UnitedMotorsports haldex control re flash

Thanks for input.
 

dopoz

Passed Driver's Ed
Also I'm confused as to when braking is applied if I have abs/ecs vagcom delete if that will affect tq transfer.


You don't have "abs delete", there is no such thing, short of pulling fuses and lighting up your dash warning lights like a Christmas tree. It would also be a particularly stupid thing to do if you could do it.

These systems aren't affected in any unexpected way by traction/stability control, as they operate largely independently of them. This has all been fairly well discussed over the years on the VWVortex forums, you should go search around there.
 

Bryan259

Ready to race!
yeah thats my question

yeah "the dude" thats my question.

Well Dopoz besides your critic of my ABS statement any insight toward the the heart of my question or just trolling? You say all over the form but I've never seen anyone bring up UM controllers, and those that have the Haldex HPA units have no real insights between race and comp. The Websites are Vauge. I would assume that as tunable as these AWD systems are that there would be more tuners and people curious as to how to push the power to the correct spots
 

thedude4bides

Go Kart Champion
yeah "the dude" thats my question.

Well Dopoz besides your critic of my ABS statement any insight toward the the heart of my question or just trolling? You say all over the form but I've never seen anyone bring up UM controllers, and those that have the Haldex HPA units have no real insights between race and comp. The Websites are Vauge. I would assume that as tunable as these AWD systems are that there would be more tuners and people curious as to how to push the power to the correct spots

Website is vague?!?! What the hell are you reading?

This: "The HPA Gen.4 Competition Controller is calibrated similar to the "Race mode" setting used in
the standard Gen.4 Performance Controllers, but has the additional feature of increasing the clutch torque when braking. By doing so, wheel brake torque is now transferred rearwards through the AWD clutch, offering a far more aggressive deceleration capability. Additionally, the Competition controller will support left foot braking without disengaging the 4-motion clutch while out on the track."

Is that not a clear differentiation for you??
 

Bryan259

Ready to race!
Clear

I'm very clear on that 1 line on the website. But besides braking is it any difference between that and race. Also UnitedMotor sports gives no depth to this. Also how do the two systems compaired a giant each other ?
 

dopoz

Passed Driver's Ed
You say all over the form but I've never seen anyone bring up UM controllers, and those that have the Haldex HPA units have no real insights between race and comp.

I said all over the VWVortex forums. This is not the VWVortex forums.
 

demon_GR

New member
I got my Comp Controller installed last week... bought from HPA. Cant say I love it or think it was an awesome mod.

Guess my butt gps just doesn't work like other peoples' but I find it daunting that none of these companies actually provide any track data, (i was sold on the dyno data but find that to be a too controlled of a case result). There is something different about the car but I honestly can't say what it is.

Would be nice however to see the companies that use this mod actually use it on the track. Report back findings, etc etc. Otherwise I think I just bought an over-glorified stock controller as I don't feel "significant" rear-bias. Top it off, part numbers between HPA and Neuspeed are the same, and also look the same. The blue is the switchable unit and the comp/race is a stealth unit with same part number so I'm a bit skeptical. Price is ~200 usd cheaper from other vendors.

my .02 cents

Good luck with your purchase... I'd like to know however what I can do with my stock Haldex... would be nice to flash it as a switchable unit and sell this comp one.
 

boost pls

Passed Driver's Ed
I have the UM Haldex flash. It wasn't a night and day difference for me, because you really only feel the effects of the AWD when you are pushing it a bit. I emailed back and forth with the main guy at UM (name escapes me at the moment) and discussed the features of their software.

Here is my understanding of the features. The UM software is similar to the stock Haldex software in that torque transfer to the rear is variable. The algorithm is just a lot more aggressive than the stock software. It is based on a lot of inputs like throttle position, speed, steering wheel angle, etc. The UM software gives large front wheel bias while cruising to maintain gas mileage, but will become aggressive under throttle or while in boost. It also keeps the Haldex clutch engaged under hard braking like the HPA comp controller.

I'm not an expert on the HPA Comp controller, but the impression I got from the forums is that its a more "full time" neutral bias.

There will never be rear bias with any of the Haldex controller products. The theoretical max output to the rear is 50% of the power because the front wheels are always spinning, even when the back is fully engaged. It's not gonna drive like a RWD car. When the rear wheels are engaged it will understeer less but you are also not going to oversteer through every turn. If you really want the full effects of your Haldex controller to shine, do the ESC defeat with VAGCOM and if you're still on stock rubber you can four wheel drift from a standstill through a u-turn. I was most impressed with the UM software this winter when I finally got to take the car out in the snow and the AWD engagement behavior was completely different than the first time I took it out back when I was still stock.

With the stock tune in the snow, I would turn into a slide, and at first the car would understeer like a mofo, and once it sensed the understeer for a bit, the back wheels would eventually kick in and send the back end around.

This year, with the UM flash, the power transfer was faster, smoother, and more seamless. There was no "understeer period" at first when turning into a slide - the car just slid wherever I wanted it to go.

Finally, if you want to hear from a reputable group that uses the UM Haldex flash on the track, I believe Tyrolsport has it on their Golf R. They may be active over on the 'tex - try sending them a PM for their feedback. One of the things that convinced me to go with the UM flash was a post by TS when the switch from the HPA comp controller over to the UM flash and commented that they didn't really notice any difference between the two on the track (or something to that effect).

But don't take my word for it, I definitely recommend running some searches on vwvortex and get others thoughts. I posted a lot about the UM flash over there in some of the threads too (my user name there is Super .:R-Type)
 

demon_GR

New member
I have the UM Haldex flash. It wasn't a night and day difference for me, because you really only feel the effects of the AWD when you are pushing it a bit.

Wow great info @Boost PLS. If its of any consolation.... my wife just told me she feels the car is so much more responsive and that she feels so much more confidence whilst driving it. :laugh::lol:

Wow could I ever be thrown off my horse!:eek:
 

ToucanLife

Ready to race!
Wow great info @Boost PLS. If its of any consolation.... my wife just told me she feels the car is so much more responsive and that she feels so much more confidence whilst driving it. :laugh::lol:

Wow could I ever be thrown off my horse!:eek:

Maybe hers is off and yours is on point ;)

Great unbiased review!
 
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