Technical Understanding: Intakes: Stock vs. Drop In vs. Aftermarket

GTIwannagofast,

Are you looking for spool times?

NS01GTI said:

For what it's worth, the volume levels between the Modshack and Carbonio are similar with the window down. The modshack makes a bit more "sucking" sound, while the Carbonio has more Darth-Vader sounds. With the windows up, you can barely hear the Modshack at all, and the Carbonio is louder in comparison. Windows up and tunes playing... Little to no intake noises are heard.

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We need a dB meter log vs. RPM for each intake from inside and outside the car now

add in p-flow logs next

We should be getting data from Plac's Apexis flow, so that might help out as well.

Sub'd to see data logs and comparisons of the AWE Tuning CCB intake.

Thank you for the evidenced-based comparison.:w00t:

Wow, great thread, right on. Yes, it was clear the Carbonio was less restrictive than the stock box that I am back to (w/pointless drop-in filter) but I couldn't get past the noise & sound which bums me out because it is clear from more 'hard data' like this that it is superior to the stock airbox. Oh well.

The only caveat though is that all these tests were run w/k04 which is just better from the start. Bigger turbo, etc. so it seems like an intake would show a more noticeable difference working in tandem w/k04 vs. with something more 'common' like stage 1 on a k03 turbo no?

Great sticky though. Real good. Thanks for your ongoing technical contribution to this forum Grambles!

Pretty much would be the same, except the graphs would probably be falling more towards redline. I would love to collaborate this for anyone who wants to run the data on a Stage 1 or 2 vehicle.

Helloooooooooo!
Stage 2 here. ;-)

grambles423 said:

GTIwannagofast,

Are you looking for spool times?

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i wanted to put a curve fit on them to see if there was a noticiable difference in the time it takes to get through the rev band. i deleted the post because there are to many major variables that would make that data not as useful... thanks though.

Grambles brought the community some excellent data in regards to the Carbonio intake and it's superior performance. It appears that APR's dyno results on their website was definitely valid. It also appears that the carbon fiber material and the mold they used is practically second to none in performance. Any attempts of making the noise more subtle by using different material or construction appears not to perform as well.

The other intakes I feel that could pose a threat to the Carbonio is the VWR, AWE CCB and the Forge Twintake/Wintake. Other than the VWR intake the other 2 relocate the MAF out of the stock location and I believe that not to be beneficial especially on an OEM or APR tune as they were both designed with the stock MAF dimensions, MAF flow straightener and stock MAF position. Even if the other 2 had the capability of flowing the same amount of air they are still hindered.

The Forge Wintake has the MAF right at the bend, assuming the piping matches OEM dimensions it no longer has the flow straightener and the position can't be optimal for laminar flow.

VWR intake is identical to the Carbonio stage 1 but without a carbon fiber housing and with a foam filter. Considering the MAF retains 100% OEM placement, it's enclosed and had a foam filter I see this challenging the Carbonio.

AWE CCB has the MAF relocated to a better position for laminar flow but still lacks the flow straightener and shares the same piping as the FSI CCB which has an entirely different MAF housing. The Carbon Fiber box and filter looks impressive but still doesn't hold a 100% seal.

Retaining factory MAF characteristics is huge as the Bosch MED17 uses reference tables calculated by the voltage it receives from the MAF. The more flow across the MAF the more voltage and if the MAF had turbulent flow or was in a position that received less velocity it could alter the tune.

I wanted to add a couple thoughts about the competing intakes and the functionality and importance of keeping the stock MAF placement. I'd absolutely love if Grambles could get his hands on those competitors.

McQueen77 said:

Wow, great thread, right on. Yes, it was clear the Carbonio was less restrictive than the stock box that I am back to (w/pointless drop-in filter) but I couldn't get past the noise & sound which bums me out because it is clear from more 'hard data' like this that it is superior to the stock airbox. Oh well.

The only caveat though is that all these tests were run w/k04 which is just better from the start. Bigger turbo, etc. so it seems like an intake would show a more noticeable difference working in tandem w/k04 vs. with something more 'common' like stage 1 on a k03 turbo no?

Great sticky though. Real good. Thanks for your ongoing technical contribution to this forum Grambles!

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After riding in a TSI with a Carbonio I don't understand the noise complaint. It seems to be a double standard as noise is okay but just not from the Carbonio intake. Many different modifications create more noise like the 8" subwoofer listed in your sig. When people upgrade from the all season Pirellis to a set of stickier tires (Michelin PSS makes more noise than the stock tires) and the road noise from tires can be pretty annoying. A aftermarket downpipe with a cat is undoubtedly louder and will make an unpleasant sound at a cold start. What's the deal with the Carbonio?

With Grambles performing these tests with a K04 it could be viewed as a positive due to the K04 airflow requirements amplifying the weaknesses and differences between the intakes. With the IHI the difference between the Modshack and Carbonio may not even be apparent.

Characteristics at 250 g/s may not show up at 180 g/s.

I wanted to add a couple thoughts about the competing intakes and the functionality and importance of keeping the stock MAF placement. I'd absolutely love if Grambles could get his hands on those competitors.

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This is trickier in that one has to question if the tune comes into play at this point or not. It is known that GIAC Stage 2 and up does play better with the CCB than the Carbonio (though at Stage 2 it is negligible, once you hit k04 it is common).

I seriously would love to get a bunch of intakes together and test them. That way things can stay consistent. No vendor wants to do that though or would ever consider that.

However even regarding the differences in tuning we should be able to expose short comings if the tune remained consistent.

can someone quickly tell me, whats the required boost for Stage1, stage 2 and K04?

I think K04 only differs in blade design and the actual turbo size is the same as K03, is that correct? If so, would I be seeing the same kind of spooling time difference in K03 turbo for these 2 aftermarket intakes as well?

In terms of mid range power and actual boost would you say the difference between aftermarket intakes(carbonio and modshack in this case) is negligible at Stage 1 or 2 level?

grambles423 said:

I seriously would love to get a bunch of untamed together and test them. That way things can stay consistent. No vendor wants to do that though or would ever consider that.

However even regarding the differences in tuning we should be able to expose short comings if the tune remained consistent.

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Wouldn't you have to run them ALL on ALL tunes to be truly scientific about it?