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Old 06-06-2014, 10:40 AM   #1
TAZZ
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Golf R Intercoolers

Couldn't find this on here so after some research here are the core volumes of aftermarket intercoolers (measurements are of height x length x thickness in inches):

Mid Mounted:
OEM R: 16.25 x 24.25 x 1.57 = 618.67 cubic inch
CTS: 16.5 x 23 x 2 = 759 cubic inch
Unitronic: 16.5 x 23.5 x 2 = 775.5 cubic inch
Eurojet: 16.5 x 23.5 x 2 = 775.5 cubic inch
APR: 16.25 x 23.2 x 2.25 = 848.25 cubic inch
SPM: 16.49 x 23 x 2.24 = 849.56 cubic inch
THS: 16.25 x 24 x 2.25 = 877.5 cubic inch
Wagner: 17.3 x 24 x 2.55 = 1058.76 cubic inch

Front Mounted:
Forge: 6 x 24.5 x 2.5 = 367 + OEM (618.67) = 985.67 cubic inch
Neuspeed (stand alone unit): 6.5 x 23.5 x 3 = 458 cubic inch
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Old 06-06-2014, 12:04 PM   #2
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Core do the Core/plates/bar factor in vs. Cubic Inches? I know overall size matters, but just wondering how the internals of the intercooler factor in.

Just recently got the OEM golf R Intercooler, might add on a front mount later If I get decide to go K04
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Old 06-07-2014, 04:33 PM   #3
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Having had the Neuspeed installed for several months I've been checking intake air temps. Even though the size difference is considerable the Neuspeed can drop intake temps to within 5 degrees of ambient. This has been repeatable in temps from 60 to 113.

Not being an expert in the theory behind intercooling I can only guess that the location is the main reason. It seems that using the stock location requires significantly more volume to achieve similar results.
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Old 06-07-2014, 04:35 PM   #4
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Old 06-07-2014, 05:02 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPM View Post
Having had the Neuspeed installed for several months I've been checking intake air temps. Even though the size difference is considerable the Neuspeed can drop intake temps to within 5 degrees of ambient. This has been repeatable in temps from 60 to 113.

Not being an expert in the theory behind intercooling I can only guess that the location is the main reason. It seems that using the stock location requires significantly more volume to achieve similar results.
its gotta be the location of the neuspeed that makes the difference
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Old 06-07-2014, 05:36 PM   #6
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good info!
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Old 06-09-2014, 10:13 AM   #7
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Help me out, would an upgraded intercooler help with acceleration by decreasing air temps, or would it make it worse due to the increased volume of airflow required? I have searched, but have read conflicting information. Any info would be appreciated.
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Old 06-09-2014, 11:05 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPM View Post
Having had the Neuspeed installed for several months I've been checking intake air temps. Even though the size difference is considerable the Neuspeed can drop intake temps to within 5 degrees of ambient. This has been repeatable in temps from 60 to 113.

Not being an expert in the theory behind intercooling I can only guess that the location is the main reason. It seems that using the stock location requires significantly more volume to achieve similar results.
Yes the front mounted location means the cooling effect can be achieved with a smaller overall core volume. That said, a mate tried mounting the forge as a single unit but the cooling effect was not that good presumably cause the forge is too small and was not initially intended to be used as a stand alone unit. So size will still matter. How do you like the Neuspeed, I read about the cooling effect being great but did you notice any increase in lag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielToombs View Post
Help me out, would an upgraded intercooler help with acceleration by decreasing air temps, or would it make it worse due to the increased volume of airflow required? I have searched, but have read conflicting information. Any info would be appreciated.
I am not really an expert but generally speaking, an intercooler helps drop the intake temperatures post turbo and before the intake manifold, so it is supposed to give you better performance as cooler air = denser air = more oxygen = more fuel + less timing pull = more power. The larger the intercooler the more heat it will dissipate and yield a better cooling effect. However a larger intercooler means also a larger volume to pressurize which takes slightly more time, this is felt as turbo lag. This lag can be noticeable and impact the daily drivability of the car, and it can be very minor and go completely unnoticed, this really depends on the setup of the car, how it is being driven and of course the climate. IMHO an upgraded intercooler should be appropriately sized in comparison to your level of tune, many of the available options are rated for power levels beyond 500hp and are way too large for a KO4.
The internal construction of the intercooler also plays a role, I am no expert but I know that some constructions will aim at slowing down the air while passing through the cooling bars so that heat is dissipated more effectively while others will on the contrary try to make it flow as fast as possible to minimize the lag effect.

A good starting point before spending your money is to check whether your car needs a better intercooler than stock or not, you can do this by checking your timing pull with a VCDS. I have polar FIS installed and my KWs stand at 0.0 on all cylinders practically always even in the summer heat, so I don't really need one
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Old 06-09-2014, 04:26 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TAZZ View Post
Yes the front mounted location means the cooling effect can be achieved with a smaller overall core volume. That said, a mate tried mounting the forge as a single unit but the cooling effect was not that good presumably cause the forge is too small and was not initially intended to be used as a stand alone unit. So size will still matter. How do you like the Neuspeed, I read about the cooling effect being great but did you notice any increase in lag?
I had a Forge on my GTI. Intake temps were better than stock, but not as good as the Neuspeed is on the R. As to lag, I'm nor really sure. So, if it does, its not much. I do believe the K04 in the R has a bit more lag than the K03 in the GTI, I noticed that when I bought the R. As I got used to the difference I didn't really notice an increase with the Neuspeed.
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Old 06-10-2014, 09:41 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPM View Post
I had a Forge on my GTI. Intake temps were better than stock, but not as good as the Neuspeed is on the R. As to lag, I'm nor really sure. So, if it does, its not much. I do believe the K04 in the R has a bit more lag than the K03 in the GTI, I noticed that when I bought the R. As I got used to the difference I didn't really notice an increase with the Neuspeed.
Yes the KO4 will take more time to spool than the KO3/IHI. Good to know that you didn't feel any worse lag with the NEUSPEED
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Old 06-10-2014, 09:48 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by RoidRage View Post
Core do the Core/plates/bar factor in vs. Cubic Inches? I know overall size matters, but just wondering how the internals of the intercooler factor in.

Just recently got the OEM golf R Intercooler, might add on a front mount later If I get decide to go K04
Yes the internal construction will also have an impact, just exactly how I don't really know. All I heard was that depending on the setup some kits aim at slowing the air for better cooling effect (I imagine that would be the case of a mid mounted kits that do not receive direct fresh air and take more advantage from the heat dissipation effect) while others tend to accelerate the air to reduce lag and pressure drop as much as possible (I presume this could apply for a front mounted kit that's in direct contact with fresh air, I'm not sure though).
It would be good to have the technical feedback of vendors on this
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Old 06-10-2014, 11:54 AM   #12
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Yes the KO4 will take more time to spool than the KO3/IHI. Good to know that you didn't feel any worse lag with the NEUSPEED
Not entirely apples to apples but I never noticed any increase in lag going from the Stock GTI intercooler to the Neuspeed intercooler. I did upgrade the dv at the same time. I'm k04 by the way.
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Old 06-11-2014, 04:29 AM   #13
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Not entirely apples to apples but I never noticed any increase in lag going from the Stock GTI intercooler to the Neuspeed intercooler. I did upgrade the dv at the same time. I'm k04 by the way.
Good to know, I'm reading a lot of positive feedback on the NEUSPEED. The GFB DV+ does reduce lag though (if installed with the additional spring) so might have compensated
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Old 06-11-2014, 08:46 AM   #14
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Good to know, I'm reading a lot of positive feedback on the NEUSPEED. The GFB DV+ does reduce lag though (if installed with the additional spring) so might have compensated
That's what I am thinking. I was hoping to run some logs this weekend now that my Dad is done with my Vag-Com, but I have to move. First world problems.
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