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Old 12-17-2015, 09:03 AM   #1
Lokiii
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Exclamation Please Help! APR Ecu Tuning stages Understanding/Plus Quetions

I'm pretty much a "N00B" with this tuning stuff so bare with me. BTW before anyone say's "use the search button" or "do research" just know i've looked for hours but havn't found a complete understanding or my questions answered.

My first point is that I have a 2010 gti dsg with about 70k....no problems n well maintained. Already have a 3" cat-less high flow downpipe(non apr) and a decent intake(non apr) without a tune. I would like to go straight to stage 2.

1.Question
Is there a different tune/file/software between stage 1 and 2? I've read that the only difference is the downpipe and intake. I've also read that there's actually different file/software.

2.Understanding/Question
Apr stage 1 is selling for $539 at the moment. Upgrading from apr stage 1 to apr stage 2 is $134. Being that I have a DP(non apr) and intake(non apr) and want to go straight to Stage 2 would I have to pay 673 or a different amount?

3.Question
I've read somewhere that you can choose which EMCS Programs you want so your'e not paying the full 149.99 for programs your not going to use. Is that true?

5.Questions
I live in Orlando Florida area I know one apr authorized dealership from the apr website. I've read people are getting charged crazy amounts of labor for installs and also read people are getting free labor all around the country. I'm very capable of taking out my ecu and shipping it somewhere to get tuned like uspmotorsport. Btw I heard uspmotorsport has poor customer service and was giving out wrong tunes. For example a guy was getting a fault code for his downpipe even know he paid for stage 2. Lol Where can I get free labor? if ship it to uspmotorsports or any other authorized dealership do they still charge labor? What if I take the ecu out and bring it to a local dealer would they charge labor?

4.Questions
What should be my estimate in total cost for the stage 2 ecu tune, labor, and minus the downpipe and intake?

6.Understanding/question
I've read that apr updated stage 2 software that people are now calling stage 2+ and one of these features is a 4k Motorsport hard Rev limter for dsg trannys. Sounds like wot box 2step but cant actually launch....like so



Will I have this when I goto stage 2 or is it something I have to ask for? Can i do that in neutral?

Conclusion
I know theres is a lot of old tune threads out there and I could do my own research which I did! I know I could simply call apr or an authorized dealership to answer my questions which I'm probably going to do, but i just want to know you guys stand point and questions answered on one thread. Btw if you guys want to throw out any other info relating to my questions do so.
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:37 AM   #2
MTBFL1
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I'm not an expert but I'll try to answer this as well as my knowledge permits me to:
Question 1:
Stage 1 is only an ECU flash that is optomized for a stock car without any supporting hardware. Stage 2 is also just an ECU flash, but it is optomized to work with an intake and downpipe in order to make more power. Yes, they are two different softwares.

Question 2:
Stage 1 IS $539 and the upgrade IS $134. Due to the fact that you don't have an APR downpipe (most people don't, price doesn't equal out), you will end up paying the $673 (plus tax). Intake brand doesn't matter.

Question 3:
Honestly not sure about this one- I believe its all files or only one, but need someone to back me up with info.

Question 5:
I haven't heard much about USP mixing up tunes or whatever, but I say your best bet is to drive in and get your ECU flashed through the OBD port. That way you can eliminate any mixups that could happen, and keep the ECU freshly sealed. I live in Fort Lauderdale, and will probably go to get my tune this weekend if everything permits.

Question 4:
Total cost will probably be in the $800's price range for the software & labor. USP is a little on the pricier side of things for labor but they'll do a good job.

Question 6:
As far as I'm aware, there is no stage 2+ file, only a stage 2. Stage 2 comes with the hard rev limiter, and you are correct, I'm 90% sure you can't launch off it. You'd probably spin your wheels a ton in a FWD car if you launch at 4K.

Hope that helps, if i'm wrong someone please correct me
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:54 AM   #3
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3. Standard tune is $600. which includes one ECMS file (e.g. 93 octane). "fully loaded" is +$150, and you can install four programs and switch between at your leisure.
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Old 12-17-2015, 10:23 AM   #4
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im confused here this is all over you not wanting to pay for labor? the most a shop shoudl be able to charge for flashing your car is half a hour as it doesnt take that long and are ecu's no longer need to be pulled to get flashed
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Old 12-17-2015, 10:56 AM   #5
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Why ship out your ECU when its all port flashed in the obd2 plug? Most shops are charging at most 1 hour labor but a lot are doing no charge.

There are a few APR shops in Orlando....
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Old 12-17-2015, 11:04 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokiii View Post
I'm pretty much a "N00B" with this tuning stuff so bare with me. BTW before anyone say's "use the search button" or "do research" just know i've looked for hours but havn't found a complete understanding or my questions answered.

My first point is that I have a 2010 gti dsg with about 70k....no problems n well maintained. Already have a 3" cat-less high flow downpipe(non apr) and a decent intake(non apr) without a tune. I would like to go straight to stage 2.

1.Question
Is there a different tune/file/software between stage 1 and 2? I've read that the only difference is the downpipe and intake. I've also read that there's actually different file/software.

2.Understanding/Question
Apr stage 1 is selling for $539 at the moment. Upgrading from apr stage 1 to apr stage 2 is $134. Being that I have a DP(non apr) and intake(non apr) and want to go straight to Stage 2 would I have to pay 673 or a different amount?

3.Question
I've read somewhere that you can choose which EMCS Programs you want so your'e not paying the full 149.99 for programs your not going to use. Is that true?

5.Questions
I live in Orlando Florida area I know one apr authorized dealership from the apr website. I've read people are getting charged crazy amounts of labor for installs and also read people are getting free labor all around the country. I'm very capable of taking out my ecu and shipping it somewhere to get tuned like uspmotorsport. Btw I heard uspmotorsport has poor customer service and was giving out wrong tunes. For example a guy was getting a fault code for his downpipe even know he paid for stage 2. Lol Where can I get free labor? if ship it to uspmotorsports or any other authorized dealership do they still charge labor? What if I take the ecu out and bring it to a local dealer would they charge labor?

4.Questions
What should be my estimate in total cost for the stage 2 ecu tune, labor, and minus the downpipe and intake?

6.Understanding/question
I've read that apr updated stage 2 software that people are now calling stage 2+ and one of these features is a 4k Motorsport hard Rev limter for dsg trannys. Sounds like wot box 2step but cant actually launch....like so



Will I have this when I goto stage 2 or is it something I have to ask for? Can i do that in neutral?

Conclusion
I know theres is a lot of old tune threads out there and I could do my own research which I did! I know I could simply call apr or an authorized dealership to answer my questions which I'm probably going to do, but i just want to know you guys stand point and questions answered on one thread. Btw if you guys want to throw out any other info relating to my questions do so.


1. Yes, there are two different files for Stage 1 and Stage 2. You do need the downpipe to upgrade to Stage 2.

2. Yes, you will have to pay the full 134.99 upgrade fee because you are running a non-APR downpipe. No, it is not worthwhile to buy APR's downpipe to save on the upgrade fee.

3. You're somewhat right about the EMCS switching. If you don't want to pay for EMCS switching, you can select ONE file to be uploaded to your car (ex. 91, 93). However, if you want ANY additional files, you will have to pay for EMCS.

4. It depends on if the shop you're headed to charges labor. If so, then you're looking at labor, tax, and obviously the tune. Typically labor is somewhere in the ballpark of $100, $675 for a Stage 2 tune, and whatever tax is in your state. Without EMCS, you're probably looking in the ballpark of $800.

5. There are quite a few places in the Orlando area that you can get tuned. Even if you're capable of taking out the ECU, shops will most likely charge you labor. For that reason, I would recommend you call around and get the best quote and just drive to the shop. Since tunes are now flashed through the OBD-II port, it's easier not to take out your ECU. If you are set on sending it out, I would recommend you send it directly to APR rather than a third party shop.

6. I haven't seen anything referring to APR's Stage 2 tune as "2+". I would double check that the posts you were reading weren't for older FSI engines or for the MK6 Golf R. FSI engines require an upgraded HPFP, an upgrade that typically adds the "+".

If you're launching, you can easily spin the tires way before 4k RPM. However, there is definitely a hard rev limiter for the DSG. That's more for preservation of the transmission than anything else. I believe the 4k limiter occurs both stock and Stage 2.


My only overall suggestion would be to spring for EMCS switching. It's always helpful for if you need to go back to stock mode for service or if you ever happen to stumble upon some race fuel .
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Old 12-17-2015, 12:22 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilonespaz View Post
Why ship out your ECU when its all port flashed in the obd2 plug? Most shops are charging at most 1 hour labor but a lot are doing no charge.
You can also flash yourself at home via some options like UniConnect and Unitronic software

https://www.moddedeuros.com/volkswag...6-10-13/tuning

Really don't need to drive to shops anymore to flash, upgrade or flash to stock
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Old 12-17-2015, 12:29 PM   #8
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Noobs like me refer to cars as stage 2+ when they have big turbo upgrades without the big turbo i.e. my APR intercooler and piping.
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Old 12-17-2015, 12:47 PM   #9
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Removing the ECU is not worth the money you save over having a shop install it through the OBD2. If something happens to the ECU you'll be paying a lot more than the $50 you saved for labor.
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:03 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sterkrazzy View Post
Removing the ECU is not worth the money you save over having a shop install it through the OBD2. If something happens to the ECU you'll be paying a lot more than the $50 you saved for labor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dafuture View Post
1. Yes, there are two different files for Stage 1 and Stage 2. You do need the downpipe to upgrade to Stage 2.

2. Yes, you will have to pay the full 134.99 upgrade fee because you are running a non-APR downpipe. No, it is not worthwhile to buy APR's downpipe to save on the upgrade fee.

3. You're somewhat right about the EMCS switching. If you don't want to pay for EMCS switching, you can select ONE file to be uploaded to your car (ex. 91, 93). However, if you want ANY additional files, you will have to pay for EMCS.

4. It depends on if the shop you're headed to charges labor. If so, then you're looking at labor, tax, and obviously the tune. Typically labor is somewhere in the ballpark of $100, $675 for a Stage 2 tune, and whatever tax is in your state. Without EMCS, you're probably looking in the ballpark of $800.

5. There are quite a few places in the Orlando area that you can get tuned. Even if you're capable of taking out the ECU, shops will most likely charge you labor. For that reason, I would recommend you call around and get the best quote and just drive to the shop. Since tunes are now flashed through the OBD-II port, it's easier not to take out your ECU. If you are set on sending it out, I would recommend you send it directly to APR rather than a third party shop.

6. I haven't seen anything referring to APR's Stage 2 tune as "2+". I would double check that the posts you were reading weren't for older FSI engines or for the MK6 Golf R. FSI engines require an upgraded HPFP, an upgrade that typically adds the "+".

If you're launching, you can easily spin the tires way before 4k RPM. However, there is definitely a hard rev limiter for the DSG. That's more for preservation of the transmission than anything else. I believe the 4k limiter occurs both stock and Stage 2.


My only overall suggestion would be to spring for EMCS switching. It's always helpful for if you need to go back to stock mode for service or if you ever happen to stumble upon some race fuel .
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTBFL1 View Post
I'm not an expert but I'll try to answer this as well as my knowledge permits me to:
Question 1:
Stage 1 is only an ECU flash that is optomized for a stock car without any supporting hardware. Stage 2 is also just an ECU flash, but it is optomized to work with an intake and downpipe in order to make more power. Yes, they are two different softwares.

Question 2:
Stage 1 IS $539 and the upgrade IS $134. Due to the fact that you don't have an APR downpipe (most people don't, price doesn't equal out), you will end up paying the $673 (plus tax). Intake brand doesn't matter.

Question 3:
Honestly not sure about this one- I believe its all files or only one, but need someone to back me up with info.

Question 5:
I haven't heard much about USP mixing up tunes or whatever, but I say your best bet is to drive in and get your ECU flashed through the OBD port. That way you can eliminate any mixups that could happen, and keep the ECU freshly sealed. I live in Fort Lauderdale, and will probably go to get my tune this weekend if everything permits.

Question 4:
Total cost will probably be in the $800's price range for the software & labor. USP is a little on the pricier side of things for labor but they'll do a good job.

Question 6:
As far as I'm aware, there is no stage 2+ file, only a stage 2. Stage 2 comes with the hard rev limiter, and you are correct, I'm 90% sure you can't launch off it. You'd probably spin your wheels a ton in a FWD car if you launch at 4K.

Hope that helps, if i'm wrong someone please correct me
All my questions was pretty much answered thanks guys. I didn't know shops flash through the port nowadays. I read they had to take them out to bench test them or somthing like that.
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:07 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilonespaz View Post
Why ship out your ECU when its all port flashed in the obd2 plug? Most shops are charging at most 1 hour labor but a lot are doing no charge.

There are a few APR shops in Orlando....
Didn't know they did it through the obd2 plug. I only see one one the Apr dealers list which is FS-tuning European Autowerks.
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Old 12-18-2015, 09:34 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokiii View Post
Didn't know they did it through the obd2 plug. I only see one one the Apr dealers list which is FS-tuning European Autowerks.
Yeah they introduced port flashing earlier this year. Makes flashing like a 20-30 minute process instead of the old hour or so long process of removing the ECU cracking it open putting in the chip and then re sealing etc. Much safer to the ECU in my opinion since it no longer has to be opened.

FS Tuning is a good shop. I got quotes for them for APR k04 installs before i decided on the F23T.

Since you already have a downpipe go stage 2. It will give you the best all around experience.

*Edit* You are correct the other shop in orlando that does APR closed down (Axis Motorsports) and the next one i can think of is in Sandford called PRS.
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just like god intended. he didnt kill off the dinosaurs for their sweet sweet bone juice to have it go getting wasted by eco-obsessed torque thieves.
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