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Old 04-01-2016, 09:11 PM   #995
Goingnowherefast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jettaglx91 View Post
That's the one I was referring to, made as much as apr/UNI cars typically make but has a couple hundred more into it now.
How do you figure? Here's the prices of said tunes with at home tuning or OBD scanning/map switching like Cobb can.

K04 from APR:
1. $599 For Tune
2. $149.99 for Stage 2
3. $499.99 for K04 tune
4. Dealer fee (We'll just call it $0 for benefit of the doubt)
Total: $1,250
After Resale of all software: $1,250

K04 from Uni:
1. $750 for Tune (Without Uniconnect)
2. $150 Uniconnect+
Total: $900
After Resale of all software: $900

Cobb:
1. $650 Cobb AP
2. Protune for K04: ~$250
Total: $900
After resale of all software: (900-500)= $400

So that dyno proves that you can make standard K04 numbers on all three mentioned tunes. Compared to the other tunes when you level the playing field as much as physically possible (Keeping in mind Cobb STILL has more features like the gauges, vdyno, and better logging then APR or Uni when you buy all the possible options for APR/Uni), Cobb is comparable at face value. When you consider resale Cobb becomes twice as cheap as Uni and three times as cheap as APR. I get what you are doing man, trying to keep peoples expectations realistic, but you must see the purpose is meant for people that might go past the stock turbo in the future. These people might not have a plan to go K04/F23T/BT right now but the Cobb gives them insurance that they CAN with no extra hassle in the future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug@frankenturbo View Post
These people just need to dyno tune a better turbo, that's all.
Exactly. When coupled with a bigger turbo like the F23T, a custom tune will be WAYYYY better than the Eurodyne base or K04 files people have been forced to use in days past on the F23T. I think the Cobb AP and a FrankenTurbo will go together quite nicely.
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Old 04-01-2016, 09:29 PM   #996
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Originally Posted by rawag77 View Post
Quick question: Do you need to hook up to a battery charger if you're just switching maps? I wanna bump up a map or 2 for my drive home this afternoon.
I've switched back and forth multiple times now and haven't connected to a charger. I've just turned off the radio and made sure nothing is using power.

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Last edited by corman1313; 04-01-2016 at 09:38 PM.
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Old 04-01-2016, 09:37 PM   #997
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Originally Posted by doug@frankenturbo View Post
These people just need to dyno tune a better turbo, that's all.
Lol okay, I wonder whether that'll cost more or less than the APR v3.1 tune. In4results
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:55 AM   #998
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Originally Posted by Goingnowherefast View Post
How do you figure? Here's the prices of said tunes with at home tuning or OBD scanning/map switching like Cobb can.




Exactly. When coupled with a bigger turbo like the F23T, a custom tune will be WAYYYY better than the Eurodyne base or K04 files people have been forced to use in days past on the F23T. I think the Cobb AP and a FrankenTurbo will go together quite nicely.
Did you really just compare a base eurodyne tune to a protuned cobb tune? How about put a pro tuned eurodyne car up against a pro tuned cobb car. I'm sure they will be nearly identical
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Old 04-02-2016, 02:25 AM   #999
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COBB tuning?!



Protune on 91 vs E30 mix, car was making 238 whp and 278 wtq so this feels like going from stock to stage 2 all over again.


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Old 04-02-2016, 06:45 AM   #1000
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Originally Posted by Azzore View Post


Protune on 91 vs E30 mix, car was making 238 whp and 278 wtq so this feels like going from stock to stage 2 all over again.


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I saw this on another post or FB or something. I want to believe a little K03 and some messing with timing could produce this graph but I'm skeptical. Seems like there is a bit too much smoothing/correction on the graph. Either way, sounds like the car rips after the tune and you should definitely give an update on how the E30 mix does long term.
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Old 04-02-2016, 07:15 AM   #1001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goingnowherefast View Post
How do you figure? Here's the prices of said tunes with at home tuning or OBD scanning/map switching like Cobb can.

K04 from APR:
1. $599 For Tune
2. $149.99 for Stage 2
3. $499.99 for K04 tune
4. Dealer fee (We'll just call it $0 for benefit of the doubt)
Total: $1,250
After Resale of all software: $1,250

K04 from Uni:
1. $750 for Tune (Without Uniconnect)
2. $150 Uniconnect+
Total: $900
After Resale of all software: $900

Cobb:
1. $650 Cobb AP
2. Protune for K04: ~$250
Total: $900
After resale of all software: (900-500)= $400


That guy already had a UNI tune I believe so wouldn't have had to spend as much to upgrade.

If he went apr it's just $899 you don't have to buy it separately to get up to the k04 software.

He spent $650 on the AP and $450 on the protune. Most shops aren't gonna tune it for $250. You might get an "e-tuner" to do that because they don't have the overhead but a legit shop doing dyno tuning isn't gonna be that cheap.

Beating the dead horse part again, yes you get the AP and its features which is worth it to some, but I'm simply referring to the power basis of every saying how much better a protune will be versus OTS
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Old 04-02-2016, 07:24 AM   #1002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azzore View Post


Protune on 91 vs E30 mix, car was making 238 whp and 278 wtq so this feels like going from stock to stage 2 all over again.


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There is so much fail in this graph any one who knows anything about a k03 can see it. For one its on a very uncommon dyno with numbers that evidently can be easily skewed. Smoothing looks like it would be set to 30. For some reason torque peak is like 1000rpm later then it should. Power and torque goes back up after 6k rpm(not sure how that's possible on a ko3). And lastly this was dyno tune but they conveniently can't/won't post the base line numbers of the Cobb 91 base map, only their tuned numbers.
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Old 04-02-2016, 11:21 AM   #1003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doug@frankenturbo View Post
These people just need to dyno tune a better turbo, that's all.
of all people on this thread, you probably have one of the more unique perspectives as cobb accesstuner could have a big effect on your turbo. have you gotten a chance to see what accesstuner has to offer compared to maestro? thanks.
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Old 04-02-2016, 11:53 AM   #1004
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Originally Posted by andysamland View Post
Did you really just compare a base eurodyne tune to a protuned cobb tune? How about put a pro tuned eurodyne car up against a pro tuned cobb car. I'm sure they will be nearly identical
Maybe you didn't read last page but I compared the two because jettagtx originally commented in the picture of the Cobb K04 dyno being in line with the competition. Most people that run F23T's either run the base Eurodyne tune or a OTS K04 tune, hence why I mentioned Eurodyne. But since you bring it up here's the same math that I did for the other options:

K04 from Eurodyne:
1. $799 for Eurodyne Maestro
2. $~250 for protune
Total: $1050
After resale: ($1050-$100 for selling the eurodyne cable): $950.

So to recap, Cobb is still the cheapest way to go K04 with a customized file not even taking into account all the features like vdyno's, gauges etc. That Eurodyne doesn't give you. When you compare it to the price of the three after you sell everything you can, then Cobb becomes twice as cheap as Eurodyne. It's clear you have a bias towards Eurodyne judging by your sig, but I still have not seen a comprehensive argument that puts Cobb behind any of the other tuners when you use it for its intended purpose.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jettaglx91 View Post
That guy already had a UNI tune I believe so wouldn't have had to spend as much to upgrade.

If he went apr it's just $899 you don't have to buy it separately to get up to the k04 software.

Beating the dead horse part again, yes you get the AP and its features which is worth it to some, but I'm simply referring to the power basis of every saying how much better a protune will be versus OTS
Yeah I gotcha, I was just comparing the products at face value for its intended audience (New customers). For the majority of people it would make no sense to switch from their tuner to Cobb.
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:03 PM   #1005
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Originally Posted by Goingnowherefast View Post



Yeah I gotcha, I was just comparing the products at face value for its intended audience (New customers). For the majority of people it would make no sense to switch from their tuner to Cobb.

I was also comparing it as a new customer. For apr and UNI you don't have to do stage1, then 2, then k04. You can go right to k04 which is obviously the cheapest route. For example the guy that did the k04 protune spent $1100 on his tune. Where as he could have got apr for $899 or UNI I believe for $850. Obviously from the tune standpoint Cobb is actually more expensive.

Yes with Cobb you get gauge and logging, But for most people so far that doesn't work or you have to to be quick enough to base off map sensor and figure out how much boost you are making and crossing your fingers that's accurate. So to me and imagine many that is negated so the sole benefit being the flash at home convenience.

On a side note, do you have Cobb?
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Old 04-02-2016, 12:29 PM   #1006
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also keep in mind that if you buy the k04 directly from APR or Unitronic, you get the software included.

i believe last christmas, HPA had a K04+software sale for like $1800, which is an absolute steal.
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Old 04-02-2016, 01:42 PM   #1007
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I still don't think its fair to an extent to compare OTS tunes with 5 years work into them with one that has 6-12months work in them.

That posted dyno does look like they used some very high smoothing setting on the dyno, but may just be for presentation.

As for where the torque is, a tuner can kind of manipulate where the power and torque comes in to an extent. But also, without talking to the customer or tuner, you may not know if it was intentionally done. Some people request specific things from a tune.

And another thing about dyno's. Depending on which types are used and how they are setup. being that these cars are based on load requests and torque requests. readings can prove completely different than when the car is used on the street.
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Old 04-02-2016, 05:58 PM   #1008
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I did a couple of pulls with my friend who have Giac E40 file, he was pushing 280whp and 367 wtq.
His car is lighter than mine when we did the race. I still pulled slowly on him. We did 50-100 pulls and some 40 to 100 (In a private road in Mexico).

I just got new wheels (lighter) and tires (Michelin PSS which is what he have) Love how the car handles. Might do a couple more to see how much difference did the weight do.

I'm gonna re-dyno soon to confirm but i don't think i'm far off tbh.
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