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Old 08-26-2017, 09:12 PM   #57
Short Bus
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If you're talking about David he has plenty of answers and things to try. I don't see that he mentioned who tuned his car but the least invasive first step seems to be to see what happens with less boost. If he's running an AccessPort that should be pretty easy and cheap.


You're eventually going to run into this problem with most cars. From a few minutes of research my impression is that the Ford ST twins have it worse, because I've seen some mention that they can overheat with a tune on the stock turbo. It's not just limited to turbo fours either, the 370Z struggles with this, so does the GT350 (non R) and Z06, and these three have cooling problems right off the assembly line.

At least we can push the K03 to it's ragged edge and the temps seem to stay under control.

I've thought about this just like you are because I'd like to get my GTI on the track and it certainly gets just as hot here as it does there. I've looked at the other options and there aren't really any better ones. I don't think there are many vehicles that can handle a roughly 75% increase in horsepower that can handle being run flat out for 25 minutes without some cooling system upgrades.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:50 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by Short Bus View Post
If you're talking about David he has plenty of answers and things to try. I don't see that he mentioned who tuned his car but the least invasive first step seems to be to see what happens with less boost. If he's running an AccessPort that should be pretty easy and cheap.


You're eventually going to run into this problem with most cars. From a few minutes of research my impression is that the Ford ST twins have it worse, because I've seen some mention that they can overheat with a tune on the stock turbo. It's not just limited to turbo fours either, the 370Z struggles with this, so does the GT350 (non R) and Z06, and these three have cooling problems right off the assembly line.

At least we can push the K03 to it's ragged edge and the temps seem to stay under control.

I've thought about this just like you are because I'd like to get my GTI on the track and it certainly gets just as hot here as it does there. I've looked at the other options and there aren't really any better ones. I don't think there are many vehicles that can handle a roughly 75% increase in horsepower that can handle being run flat out for 25 minutes without some cooling system upgrades.
Yes its very true, I did track my Evo 9 MR at least twice a month in 100+F heat at Chuckawalla Raceway in Blythe, CA which is probably one of the "hottest" tracks, Literally speaking in the USA. My Evo on E85 stock Turbo was making roughly 400whp, 392 to be exact and it dyno'd at 225 stock so almost 200 whp more than stock, I never had an over heating issue. Not Once. My sessions would be about 20 minutes each, Idle cool downs in between.

Some cars have better designs than others that is for sure. Evo X's I have seen get warm, but my 9 never did. I ran stock Radiator too. Just saying.

I think I am going to pass on the K04 build. Looks like a potential problem that I am not willing to deal with on my particular car. I am thinking just Stage II, Downpipe and I/C and supporting mods like Coil packs and such. If the K03 maxed out doesn't have over heating issues, then to me that is the better route to go.

Thoughts.


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Old 08-27-2017, 06:02 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Jeffs2013GTI View Post
Yes its very true, I did track my Evo 9 MR at least twice a month in 100+F heat at Chuckawalla Raceway in Blythe, CA which is probably one of the "hottest" tracks, Literally speaking in the USA. My Evo on E85 stock Turbo was making roughly 400whp, 392 to be exact and it dyno'd at 225 stock so almost 200 whp more than stock, I never had an over heating issue. Not Once. My sessions would be about 20 minutes each, Idle cool downs in between.

Some cars have better designs than others that is for sure. Evo X's I have seen get warm, but my 9 never did. I ran stock Radiator too. Just saying.

I think I am going to pass on the K04 build. Looks like a potential problem that I am not willing to deal with on my particular car. I am thinking just Stage II, Downpipe and I/C and supporting mods like Coil packs and such. If the K03 maxed out doesn't have over heating issues, then to me that is the better route to go.

Thoughts.


Jeff
Many many folks have tracked K04 cars without heat issues, including me for the last few years. Don't pass up the K04 if you have the finances to afford the conversion. It transforms the car.

The folks with heat issues are the exception, modified K04 cars don't consistently or inherently have heat issues. I live in a hot climate and using an APR intercooler (not fmic) and water meth my car has done fine at the track running a race type tune in very hot weather 100+ degrees (stock radiator).
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Old 08-27-2017, 06:13 PM   #60
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Many many folks have tracked K04 cars without heat issues, including me for the last few years. Don't pass up the K04 if you have the finances to afford the conversion. It transforms the car.

The folks with heat issues are the exception, modified K04 cars don't consistently or inherently have heat issues. I live in a hot climate and using an APR intercooler (not fmic) and water meth my car has done fine at the track running a race type tune in very hot weather 100+ degrees (stock radiator).
well if your running WMI that could be your savior. Seems to be a pretty common problem from people I have been PM'ing on the forums that have K04's and track their cars.

What track to you race at, and what ambient air temps are there? Last time I went to the track in my 9 MR at chuckawalla raceway track temps were 130F I still had no over heating problems. This was in late 2012 before I bought my GTI. Have not been back since, but where I live?? 90% of the time is the warmest spot in the USA from June-September. Crazy here. haha

Others have posted problems running in much cooler places. May not be an inherent problem, but still a potential problem. Who knows right? Dropping that kind of dime though I would want no overheating issues at all. Maybe I am asking too much? or being overly optimistic?

Jeff

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Old 08-27-2017, 07:57 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Jeffs2013GTI View Post
Yes its very true, I did track my Evo 9 MR at least twice a month in 100+F heat at Chuckawalla Raceway in Blythe, CA which is probably one of the "hottest" tracks, Literally speaking in the USA. My Evo on E85 stock Turbo was making roughly 400whp, 392 to be exact and it dyno'd at 225 stock so almost 200 whp more than stock, I never had an over heating issue. Not Once. My sessions would be about 20 minutes each, Idle cool downs in between.

Some cars have better designs than others that is for sure. Evo X's I have seen get warm, but my 9 never did. I ran stock Radiator too. Just saying.

I think I am going to pass on the K04 build. Looks like a potential problem that I am not willing to deal with on my particular car. I am thinking just Stage II, Downpipe and I/C and supporting mods like Coil packs and such. If the K03 maxed out doesn't have over heating issues, then to me that is the better route to go.

Thoughts.


Jeff
Every car has a thing or two that you have to deal with when you modify it. It's good that you didn't have any issues with your EVO, but please allow his thread to be focused finding and documenting effective solutions for the GTI.

I think you should do what was recommended in the thread you made in the "GTI vs...." forum. Don't jump straight to a K04, just go up the upgrade path like most do. You may find that you're perfectly happy with just the basic bolt on and a tune.
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Old 08-27-2017, 10:05 PM   #62
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well if your running WMI that could be your savior. Seems to be a pretty common problem from people I have been PM'ing on the forums that have K04's and track their cars.

What track to you race at, and what ambient air temps are there? Last time I went to the track in my 9 MR at chuckawalla raceway track temps were 130F I still had no over heating problems. This was in late 2012 before I bought my GTI. Have not been back since, but where I live?? 90% of the time is the warmest spot in the USA from June-September. Crazy here. haha

Others have posted problems running in much cooler places. May not be an inherent problem, but still a potential problem. Who knows right? Dropping that kind of dime though I would want no overheating issues at all. Maybe I am asking too much? or being overly optimistic?

Jeff
You win the contest of who lives in hottest area but Riverside gets way over 100 in summer too. I have lived here most of my life and hot ambient temps have always been difficult to deal with on any of the forced induction cars I have had.

Intercoolers no matter how large are limited by the ambient air temps. Water Meth allows for a way to greatly reduce air temps even further with evap qualities of water and meth and of course Methanol provides additional knock retard as it is about 116 octane.

I have run AAA Speedway in Fontana on triple digit days. I go through tank of gas and about 4.75 gal of water meth.
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Old 08-27-2017, 10:33 PM   #63
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Every car has a thing or two that you have to deal with when you modify it. It's good that you didn't have any issues with your EVO, but please allow his thread to be focused finding and documenting effective solutions for the GTI.



I think you should do what was recommended in the thread you made in the "GTI vs...." forum. Don't jump straight to a K04, just go up the upgrade path like most do. You may find that you're perfectly happy with just the basic bolt on and a tune.


Lol this guy can't get over the discontinued EVO. I bet I can find more issues with the EVO than with the GTI. Mitsubishi ain't even making cars no more right? Lol sad....


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Old 08-27-2017, 11:47 PM   #64
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Lol this guy can't get over the discontinued EVO. I bet I can find more issues with the EVO than with the GTI. Mitsubishi ain't even making cars no more right? Lol sad....


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My buddy's evo has been down for almost a year. Thing is constantly having problems.


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Old 08-28-2017, 01:41 AM   #65
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Last time I went to the track in my 9 MR at chuckawalla raceway track temps were 130F I still had no over heating problems.
It's almost as if the evo has a large vent to create a bigger low pressure area behind the radiator.
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Old 08-28-2017, 01:46 AM   #66
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Lol this guy can't get over the discontinued EVO. I bet I can find more issues with the EVO than with the GTI. Mitsubishi ain't even making cars no more right? Lol sad....
I really like all the EVOs that came before the X, and as I understand it if you care for them they're more durable as track day toys than most other vehicles, but finding one that doesn't pull more cash out of your pocket than the value of a four year old GTI + the cost of a radiator upgrade seems unlikely.

Anyway, that's all I have left to say about that.
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Old 08-28-2017, 02:45 AM   #67
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I really like all the EVOs that came before the X, and as I understand it if you care for them they're more durable as track day toys than most other vehicles, but finding one that doesn't pull more cash out of your pocket than the value of a four year old GTI + the cost of a radiator upgrade seems unlikely.

Anyway, that's all I have left to say about that.
i didn't care for the X either. my fav was the 9. but mitsubishi is as dead as circuit city now anyways. i rather get a TT-RS or an RS3 but i'm a euro car type of guy.
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:26 PM   #68
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Lol this guy can't get over the discontinued EVO. I bet I can find more issues with the EVO than with the GTI. Mitsubishi ain't even making cars no more right? Lol sad....


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If you have not owned one dont hate. I have owned 4 and a GTI. So dont mock something you personally no nothing about.

Issues of overheating on the track are huge. People down play this, well the ones that do have very little track time, or only do parking lot coned courses where you are barely out of 2nd gear. When your on a real track and things get hot, it can be very dangerous, especially for a car like the GTI that goes into limp mode and cuts boosts or the TCU for the DSG if you have a DSG decides it has had enough. People like this guy is why I dont train new drivers, they just "assume" too much.

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Old 08-28-2017, 12:27 PM   #69
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My buddy's evo has been down for almost a year. Thing is constantly having problems.


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Out of curiosity what problems? Most I know of are Human Error, not the cars.

So please tell me these "problems" and bet they are associated with his mods and very poor tuning.

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Old 08-28-2017, 12:28 PM   #70
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I really like all the EVOs that came before the X, and as I understand it if you care for them they're more durable as track day toys than most other vehicles, but finding one that doesn't pull more cash out of your pocket than the value of a four year old GTI + the cost of a radiator upgrade seems unlikely.

Anyway, that's all I have left to say about that.
Very Valid Point.


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