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Old 10-11-2019, 02:04 PM   #1
VadGTI
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Timing chain and Block 93/VCDS/OBD Eleven weirdness

I have a 2013 2.0T with 62k miles. In researching the timing chain/tensioner stuff for my gf (who was looking at a 2010 GTI), I discovered that one can scan Block 93 to determine whether there is any chain stretch. Apparently, according to posts on here (as well as a DAP video), anything outside either +/- 4.00 degrees (per posts on here) or +/- 5.00 degrees signals a timing chain issue.

So, last weekend, I go and scan my car and end up with a -3.98. So, naturally, I go wtf? It's a 62k mile 2013 car, presumably with an updated tensioner (engine made 5/13) and oil changes in excess of factory.

I go looking on the web, and realize that the Audi guys have their own theory. According to various posts and a thread, they believe their 2.0Ts are good if they're within +/- 7.00. They've even plotted charts for mileage vs. degrees for Block 93.

So, why is it that VW guys think it's +/- 4.00 while Audi guys think it's +/- 7.00?

Aside from that, I have now scanned my car several times since last weekend and the number keeps changing, sometimes multiple times per day. So far, I've had:

-3.33
-3.54
-3.81
-3.89
-4.07

The 4.07 was early last week. The last scan was last night at 3.33.

Why the hell are these changing within such a wide range?
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:28 PM   #2
BudgetPhoenix
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Cam position is not static due to the nature of VVT engines, the cam position can be adjusted by the ECU so expect the number to be within a range. Also the cam phase adjustment degree will usually get lower as the engine fully warms up. Not sure about the audi guys but I know mine was stretched at ~ -4.5 degrees and I was getting startup rattle with a hot engine after letting car sit and starting again even with an updated tensioner installed. Put in a new chain and it was all fixed and cam phase adjustment dropped down to -1.5 ish
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Old 10-11-2019, 03:20 PM   #3
Tony48
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There's no definitive answer to safe range for block 093. It's only an indication that many have found reliable as a quick check.

Block 093 basically measures the difference in cam timing between what the ECU expects and the actual value. The number grows as the chain "stretches" (technically wears since chains do not stretch but that is semantics). The number will jump drastically if a cam skips a tooth due to lack of tension in the chain.

With a 2013 car you *should* be safe from catastrophic failure due to a failing chain tensioner since you have the newer revision tensioner. You are still subject to cam chain "stretch" since you have the old revision chain. There has been a revised cam chain released that is supposed to reduce "stretch." Below is a picture of the old (left) vs new (right) cam chains from when I replaced mine. Notice the doubled up links.

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Old 10-11-2019, 04:34 PM   #4
VadGTI
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Do the numbers I posted suggest stretch? If so, has anyone had any luck having VW cover this on a 2013+ (not subject to the timing tensioner issue)? After all, I'm only at 62k miles. Unfortunately, my extended warranty just ran out.
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Old 10-11-2019, 05:18 PM   #5
GolNat
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Does it matter when you check it? Is it suppose to be a from a cold engine once it settles down to normal idle?
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Old 10-11-2019, 05:25 PM   #6
BudgetPhoenix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VadGTI View Post
Do the numbers I posted suggest stretch? If so, has anyone had any luck having VW cover this on a 2013+ (not subject to the timing tensioner issue)? After all, I'm only at 62k miles. Unfortunately, my extended warranty just ran out.
Never heard of VW covering the chain outside of warranty. TBH youre probably fine for now, keep an eye on it. At least you have an updated tensioner which is the bigger issue. The main thing you have to worry about really is the chain getting really stretched it can skip a tooth on the cam gears. The chain can get so stretched it actually starts to dig into a splash plate on the timing cover.
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Old 10-11-2019, 05:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GolNat View Post
Does it matter when you check it? Is it suppose to be a from a cold engine once it settles down to normal idle?
When the engine is warmed up.
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