The Driver Motorsport Review that never happen

[Driver Motorsport]

Just to clarify our position and we'll butt out.


We failed on 3 things we said we'd deliver. The Programmer's compatibility, the rev-hang delete and time spent looking at the car @ SOWO. Because of this, we refunded the software in full after 4 months. The software was refunded the same day we received the programmer. No excuses, none of those 3 aspects worked.

They even said that “all their other beetle customers have been satisfied.” Little did I know this was a typical sales pitch as they hadn’t tuned any 2012+ beetles yet.

I went through the PM's my brother had with you, we never said this. This statement from you I personally find troubling. Prior to you purchasing anything, Garrett said this to you on January 31st;

"We've done MED17.5.2 on MK6 GLI/Passat/Tiguan but never a Beetle so we wanted to do our due diligence."

BUT, they shipped in a padded envelope via USPS priority mail. Since they didn’t ship it overnight, even though they said they would, I ended up having to pay for a rental car for an additional 2 days. Again, I shrug it off, no big deal, the ecu was in one piece and the car started right up.

I got billed for over $45 on return shipping. I didn't personally package it, but I don't think that Priority Mail costs $45. When ECUs are sent, they're sent back in the same packaging.

I honestly can’t remember how much time went by, probably a couple of weeks, but I finally received the programmer. I was very disappointed when I first got it. It looked like a portable toy gaming system, no instructions, no nothing with it. I email DM to let them know I got it, and they send me the software for it. I load it up, it won’t connect to my car. Now, I have been in IT for over 10 years. I manage a service desk for a large energy company. I also support several small businesses on the side and I’m basically one of the biggest geeks you’ll meet lol.

Mario,

We provided technical support. I used TeamViewer and personally set up your Programmer remotely. When you first received your Programmer, we received an email on Friday, Feb 14th after business hours. We got back to you on the 17th with instructions and later on that evening we signed onto teamviewer. Again, We did not hand you a Programmer and Software to use it without any guidance.

I drive 100 miles a day ROUND TRIP just for work, but I did give it a while before I went back to DM (Driver Motorsport, I’ll use the acronym for the rest of this lol) to say that the rev hang delete didn’t work. In any case, I email DM (because they wouldn’t give me a phone number, which should have been a clue) and explain that the rev hang is still present. Here’s where I start to notice something isn’t right, I don’t get a response for a couple of days. I know people are busy, but when I wanted to buy his tune they were responding immediately, but when I have problems suddenly they are too busy?

I personally was looking at your data logs the day you sent them on February 8th... this was on a Saturday. The data you sent was looked at 1 hour after you sending it.. This was on the weekend. We were speaking to you the same day you received your ECU back from us.

Also;


Other customers having issues, I do not know of an open case where people are having software issues. If this was the case, we would've been contacted to remedy it. Majority of the customers have a programmer, if there's a problem they do not hesitate to bring it up or ask for some type of revision. We get these types of requests probably more than anybody. If there is an issue with other customers, please point us in their direction. This is especially troubling when you yourself said you were satisfied with the software outside of the rev-hang.

First let me say I’m not the type to bash anyone online and this is not going to be a bash session.

After reading your entire post(s) and double checking the facts, I do not believe this to be true. We have refunded your money, it seems as though you want more than your money refunded and that is why this post is seemingly out for 'blood'. Responding to a customer in this manner is not something we have ever done, but in the case when things are fabricated or exaggerated we have to step in. Things were fine until SOWO, you even offered to help us get our database backed up. Things turned ugly after we did not work on your car @ SOWO. I truly am sorry. Your situation was one of the major stresses/concerns on my mind that entire Saturday. In hindsight, I should've been cautious and said it was not possible.

Here are the cliff notes:

Good -
a) Car drives fine, you stated you preferred the way it drove (sans rev hang). When you got your ECU back, everything started up and drove with no issues. The ECU was handled properly.
b) You visit a dyno and ended up with more power than we advertise on our Stage 2 file. Your car had the highest dyno #'s out of all other 2.0T VAG including other TSI cars tuned by competiors.
c) The linear throttle feature was something you said enhanced the driving experience.
d) We refunded you in full, the same day everything was returned. We offered it and gave it to you no questions asked.

Bad -
a) The Rev-Hang was not fixed. We've since stopped advertising it for med17.5.2.
b) The Programmers ended up not being compatible.
c) The speed limiter was active, it was our first time making a file for your box code and we were on a time clock (you had a rental) so it got forgotten. Since this time, all med17.5.2 files were looked at and the 3 that did not have this removed were patched.
d) We were not able to meet you at SOWO.

I'm sorry, we can't do anymore. We refunded you because we didn't live up to our word. I've since removed the features from our product offerings. As a business, I can't do more than that. As far as industry standards go, you received a product that is extremely competitive with the market. The downfall is that you did not received things you were told you would get and I recognize that.

Let's keep in mind, nobody offers any of these things for med17.5.2. This entire issue was created from promising things off of assumption, that was the mistake. Nobody has bothered to look at rev-hang back when you decided to purchase the software and based off of our success with med17.x I said we could and gave you nearly 50% off of the sale to attempt to create a relationship and gain happy customers. It didn't work out, so I refunded you. Let's also keep in mind, I offered a full refund to you after finding out the Programmers did not work. I gave you multiple attempts out of the situation and told you that solutions were week(s) away at a time. Us not emailing you for a few weeks after making that statement is not unusual.

- Bronson

 

[ViRtUaLheretic]

After reading your entire post(s) and double checking the facts, I do not believe this to be true. We have refunded your money, it seems as though you want more than your money refunded and that is why this post is seemingly out for 'blood'. Responding to a customer in this manner is not something we have ever done, but in the case when things are fabricated or exaggerated we have to step in. Things were fine until SOWO, you even offered to help us get our database backed up. Things turned ugly after we did not work on your car @ SOWO. I truly am sorry. Your situation was one of the major stresses/concerns on my mind that entire Saturday. In hindsight, I should've been cautious and said it was not possible.

- Bronson

DrTechy took the high road and took the time to write up a solid response.
TRUST ME he is not looking for 'blood' he truly just wanted to vent and inform others of his dealings with you and your company.
Not all of his response was negative, he genuinely liked the tune but it didnt live up to the promise so he moved on.
DrTechy has spent MONTHS and HUNDREDS of dollars trying to chase and fix this damn rev hang and you left a sour taste in his mouth.
If he wanted to slander your name he would be flinging epic amounts of rabid ape shit.

OP is neither fabricated or exaggerated

 

[Driver Motorsport]

DrTechy took the high road and took the time to write up a solid response.
TRUST ME he is not looking for 'blood' he truly just wanted to vent and inform others of his dealings with you and your company.
DrTechy has spent MONTHS and HUNDREDS of dollars trying to chase and fix this damn rev hang and you left a sour taste in his mouth.
If he wanted to slander your name he would be flinging epic amounts of rabid ape shit.

OP is neither fabricated or exaggerated

We're posting everything publicly, saved it all and uploading it to Dropbox. There is likely over 100 emails here. If need be, I can save PMs and do the same. I have no issue with a review, even a negative one. When statements are made that are not true and damaging I have to respond (reference my last email). As far as spending money, the cost was $350.00 ($300 off). The cost was enough to cover the programmer, Paypal fees and shipping on our end. We were not looking to make money, we wanted to help a forum member but the techniques used on med17.x did not work on med17.5.2 and it didn't work out so he was refunded in full. In this case, I think it's best to leave it all out in the open.

- Bronson.

 

[Driver Motorsport]

Emails were posted by OP;

As you can see in these emails, we've been communicating for months. I encourage everybody to look at the time stamps. Anybody that feels concerned about this thread, I urge you to check the pdf files in our Dropbox. We have a happy client list a mile long, we've done well for ourselves in our short time in this industry because if we mess up, we do our best to fix it. If that means a new file revision, a refund, discount, etc.. We do it. In this case, we messed up by not living up to our promises and the only solution was a refund (file revisions weren't possible due to ECU type). For our other Beetle Customer, as soon as Linden VW receives their new tools he's receiving a DSG flash 50% off and a new file to patch the speed limiter.

Granted, this is not all of the emails. Some emails were sent to the DM sales email, those had to get erased because of godaddy's storage limitations so we cannot keep things from months ago.

In a case where something can be extremely damaging the material in question should be shared. There is probably 100 emails here and that is not including other emails accounts. Probably 90% of it was answered within 24 hours with some of it was even answered on the weekends. I do not think anybody has shared ~100 emails with their tuner, or had regular contact with them on the weekend. Prior to SOWO, because of the amount of communication we've had over the past 3-5 months I thought we had a decent customer relationship which is what makes this thread difficult from a personal standpoint.

We're not angels and we do make mistakes but we're not terrible either. We stepped up to the plate and refunded everything and I figured this saga ended there. Sharing it with others or even not recommending us is fine, but making claims such that we informed our customer that we made software for other Beetles when I have a PM stating we didn't forces my hand to set the record straight.

 

[Motodude310]

Aside from this thread all I've heard about DM is great customer service. You can basically customize your tune to the hardware you have to a "T". If I go the meth route I'll be hitting you guys up.

 

[McFuzz]

On one hand - DM is a new 'company' (and I use that term loosely) with not as many resources as the leading competitors.

On the other hand - if I was in DM's shoes, I'd focus on the true and proven, ensure that the product line is solid, that there's good support behind it, that all the bugs are written out and enjoy the cash-flow.

If DM is as good as everyone claims (minus the customer support aspect of things), then I can't see why they would want to venture into things that require considerable R&D and deliver a half-assed non-working product... IMHO, DM should ride the cash cow, get capital, get proper support resources (because no one likes to be left in the dark regardless of whether there is work done or not), invest in decent R&D and release a working, true-n-tested product line.


Personally - it pisses me off that everyone is trying to get profit and as much of it as possible while cutting corners that should not be cut. Cut into your revenue a bit, use it to better the organization - so what if you will not be able to afford that fancy watch or that vacation - there's always next year!


Bleh.

 

[Driver Motorsport]

On one hand - DM is a new 'company' (and I use that term loosely) with not as many resources as the leading competitors.

On the other hand - if I was in DM's shoes, I'd focus on the true and proven, ensure that the product line is solid, that there's good support behind it, that all the bugs are written out and enjoy the cash-flow.

If DM is as good as everyone claims (minus the customer support aspect of things), then I can't see why they would want to venture into things that require considerable R&D and deliver a half-assed non-working product... IMHO, DM should ride the cash cow, get capital, get proper support resources (because no one likes to be left in the dark regardless of whether there is work done or not), invest in decent R&D and release a working, true-n-tested product line.


Personally - it pisses me off that everyone is trying to get profit and as much of it as possible while cutting corners that should not be cut. Cut into your revenue a bit, use it to better the organization - so what if you will not be able to afford that fancy watch or that vacation - there's always next year!


Bleh.

I see a lot of merit in this post, the issue that created this mess was moving too quickly and making assumptions. It was definitely a lesson learned as a business. The part about us being new and not having a very hefty R&D budget is true as well. This scenario clearly didn't play out well but this thread was created over a feature that did not work.

The actual file itself as far as drivability and power performed well as referenced in the original post. This will be the case with all of our production TSI files and DSG files.

 

[drtechy]

I didn't write this thread to get into a pissing match with you Bronson, but I do understand your need to respond so I have no problem with that. I do have a few clarifications written below in blue because some of it you're right, but some of it, not so much. This is the only time I'll respond to you because honestly part of the reason I wrote the thread was to just be done with you! And done lol!

We failed on 3 things we said we'd deliver. The Programmer's compatibility, the rev-hang delete and time spent looking at the car @ SOWO. Because of this, we refunded the software in full after 4 months. The software was refunded the same day we received the programmer. No excuses, none of those 3 aspects worked.

You failed on much more than this if you include the lack of responses. If you really want to post each other's sent items and see who has the bigger e-penis then fine, personally I don't think it's worth it. And please don't give me the BS of not being able to keep up with the demand. Customer service is number one in any business, if you don't respond, threads like this become created!


I went through the PM's my brother had with you, we never said this. This statement from you I personally find troubling. Prior to you purchasing anything, Garrett said this to you on January 31st;

"We've done MED17.5.2 on MK6 GLI/Passat/Tiguan but never a Beetle so we wanted to do our due diligence."

This I admit was not entirely accurate. I remembered incorrectly, so sue me. Here is a screenshot of what was actually said. My mind interpreted as if you meant you had more beetle customers than just myself and JP at the time (And let me just say, JP if you're reading this, I didn't mean to get you involved or anything in this.) Again my mistake, but even now reading it, it still sounds like you have more beetle customers.

I got billed for over $45 on return shipping. I didn't personally package it, but I don't think that Priority Mail costs $45. When ECUs are sent, they're sent back in the same packaging.

I shipped it to you in a box, with packaging in it. It was returned to me in a padded envelope. Plain and simple. Believe what you want.

Mario,

We provided technical support. I used TeamViewer and personally set up your Programmer remotely. When you first received your Programmer, we received an email on Friday, Feb 14th after business hours. We got back to you on the 17th with instructions and later on that evening we signed onto teamviewer. Again, We did not hand you a Programmer and Software to use it without any guidance.

Did I say you didn't do that? I was just giving my opinion on how poor the programmer looked and was packaged. I mean most electronic stuff you buy these days at least has some sort of label on it or something. Along with some sort of documentation, or even just a pamphlet lol. This had nothing whatsoever. Even the sticker they put on the front to cover the electronics and show you where to press for the buttons wasn't even lined up right. Look at this picture on the left side of it:

I personally was looking at your data logs the day you sent them on February 8th... this was on a Saturday. The data you sent was looked at 1 hour after you sending it.. This was on the weekend. We were speaking to you the same day you received your ECU back from us.

I was talking about later on during the extent of our business, again I mentioned my timeline may not be quite right in this, it's tough when you're dealing with an issue for a year, and a tuner for 6 months.

Also;


Other customers having issues, I do not know of an open case where people are having software issues. If this was the case, we would've been contacted to remedy it. Majority of the customers have a programmer, if there's a problem they do not hesitate to bring it up or ask for some type of revision. We get these types of requests probably more than anybody. If there is an issue with other customers, please point us in their direction. This is especially troubling when you yourself said you were satisfied with the software outside of the rev-hang.

Guess this person was lying to me then, everyone can judge for themselves who they believe on this. Or perhaps they will chime in.


After reading your entire post(s) and double checking the facts, I do not believe this to be true. We have refunded your money, it seems as though you want more than your money refunded and that is why this post is seemingly out for 'blood'. Responding to a customer in this manner is not something we have ever done, but in the case when things are fabricated or exaggerated we have to step in. Things were fine until SOWO, you even offered to help us get our database backed up. Things turned ugly after we did not work on your car @ SOWO. I truly am sorry. Your situation was one of the major stresses/concerns on my mind that entire Saturday. In hindsight, I should've been cautious and said it was not possible.

Maybe this was my fault, but as I've said in my post, a lot of the times that I should have been mad, I wasn't. I just shrugged it off. And again, I didn't write this thread to have a pissing match or bash on anyone. I did give you positive feedback as well, most people wouldn't bother. You have a lot to do when it comes to your customer service. Unfortunately that's part of my business, so I consider it a huge problem when I get poor service. And this thread is the result of that unfortunately.

 

[Driver Motorsport]

EDIT:

Saw where you said it was fine. I'll fix the original post and include the emails again.

 

[drtechy]

May I post the 100+ email trail? It'd clarify some of the misunderstandings of lack of communication.

- Bronson

EDIT:

Saw where you said it was fine. I'll fix the original post and include the emails again.

You're a fool! Especially if you think people are going to bother reading through all this crap. 99% of the people that saw this thread and responded probably won't give a dam anymore. But just for grins here are all my emails involving DM. If people really wanna waste their time looking through all that then fine, but I doubt they will. I'll tell you right now I won't be bothering to look through any of it. EDIT: After quickly reviewing and seeing my phone number listed in the emails I have to ask for a PM to see them so I can keep track of who sees them.[/URL]

 

[eurocars1]

i've seen the messages. TLDR, DM needs to learn from this experience which it looks like they are. Mistakes were made; I disliked the part about not showing up at sowo especially when another person was asked "if anyone else would be there with them" and then never showing up. i was with both parties at the time, waited for a couple hours, went to eat because we got tired of waiting, still nothing happened. Supposedly you needed/wanted to talk to me also? Closed the thread on mk5 btw

 

[Driver Motorsport]

Mario,

This will be my last post and I'll finally let this thread be. Here's where I have issues and why I've been actively trying to defend myself.

"You failed on much more than this if you include the lack of responses. If you really want to post each other's sent items and see who has the bigger e-penis then fine, personally I don't think it's worth it. And please don't give me the BS of not being able to keep up with the demand. Customer service is number one in any business, if you don't respond, threads like this become created!"

With the way this thread was constructed/worded was as if we profited off of your sale and disappeared after receiving your money. I have more replies than I can count to your emails. I wanted to refund you a few days after we found out the Programmer wasn't working as I knew it'd be a long road. I reiterated the refund option as soon as we started hitting delays. I could tell from there that this was going to end up in a disaster because we were the last in the line of the attempts you took to fix the rev-hang on your vehicle and you were frustrated about VW's software induced 'rev-hang'.

"This I admit was not entirely accurate. I remembered incorrectly, so sue me. Here is a screenshot of what was actually said. My mind interpreted as if you meant you had more beetle customers than just myself and JP at the time (And let me just say, JP if you're reading this, I didn't mean to get you involved or anything in this.) Again my mistake, but even now reading it, it still sounds like you have more beetle customers."

This is a hobby for most everybody who visits this website. For myself and my brother, we're not just employees, this is our business and our blood, sweat & tears. We built this from the ground up. When you post in the public domain that we pulled a bait and switch sales technique to sell software and we did not, that is damaging.

I'm sorry Mario, this was never in the plans when I first agreed to discount the software and spend the time defining and creating the files for a Beetle.

I do appreciate you making the emails public domain.

 

[Driver Motorsport]

i've seen the messages. TLDR, DM needs to learn from this experience which it looks like they are. Mistakes were made; I disliked the part about not showing up at sowo especially when another person was asked "if anyone else would be there with them" and then never showing up. i was with both parties at the time, waited for a couple hours, went to eat because we got tired of waiting, still nothing happened. Supposedly you needed/wanted to talk to me also? Closed the thread on mk5 btw

SOWO was rough. Just all around, we got murdered as far as time mgmt goes. I especially feel bad for Eric (ErBall) as I've gotten to know him over the past few months. By the time I was good to go (12:00-12:30) it seems as though everybody packed up. Not just that, I really wanted to finally get to see and check out the car I made big turbo software for when it's a turbo I've never gotten to experience.

Yep, I wanted to talk to you. We spoke last year and I was curious about your car. I'm also close friends with Taylor and was wondering about what all went on (I never wanted to bug Taylor about it).

 

[eurocars1]

Yep, I wanted to talk to you. We spoke last year and I was curious about your car. I'm also close friends with Taylor and was wondering about what all went on (I never wanted to bug Taylor about it).

TLDR is he never got his software to work (after almost 2 years or software changes and hardware diagnosis/parts swapping), I went with Etuners out of Greece, got a good file the first try. Asked taylor for a refund, he said no with no reasoning except that "i can't and i don't offer a warranty", we compromised with me getting a stage 2+ k03 file for another mkv I bought.

 

[xd-data-ii]

Frankly, imo all this encourages me even more about Driver Motorsport.
I like what I am seeing about their products, the results, their methology, their service and like all their responses. I'd have no problem choosing them and this doesn't bother me at all. I just need to find my direction to require the move from the other company.