Turbo to max out stock engine capabilities (K04, F23T, GT Series, others...)

[thatspsychotic]

Devens as in Fort Devens? Next summer will be my first time but I was planning on going to a lot in Hartford that's hosted by C.A.R.T CT. Wouldn't be against other places either

Devens as in the former Moore AAF in Devens, MA, run by SCCA New England Region. Looks like it is near the current Fort Devens. It's probably a haul for you, but it is a former airfield, and the courses are set up on the old runways. Its a blast, usually ~100-140 drivers with some nationally ranked, and they have a great novice program that I went through this past summer.

Hit me with a PM if you want more info.

 

[FriggenT1]

I agree whole heartedly with this! I want more power I know FWD is a limiting factor but let's be honest we're not all professional drivers and aside from the fact that you can't kick the rear end out even on a track we aren't really missing out on much if anything. I'd bet most people's times are limited by personal abilities 1st, appropriate suspension and tires for said track this includes brakes, and power output before they're ever limited by FWD.

I'm guilty I won't lie I think of what's the highest level of performance I can buy all the time, I should be asking what's the highest level of performance I can produce with my skills and the answer is very different.

I'm going to go big turbo because I want to feel the BT pull at 60+ mph and probably let off by 75mph 99% of the time, and stop fighting the traction issues of instant torque. And aside from 10 miles a year at most that will be on a race track I'll be commuting to the office, picking up food that will clog my arteries, and take random items and family members from point a to point b. I'll be able to put my wife in the driver seat with no fear. You can't do that with a purpose built sports car. I have no need for the power I have now nor the future power of the car it's a hobby for me and the fact that the car remains liveable for daily driving if I need it to do it is what makes it all worth while for me.

Of course this is different for every owner but in general if you're on an enthusiast forum you can bet most people here are going to be about modifying the platform to any extent the aftermarket supports. And anyone who thinks outside that box to take the platform further will be persecuted for it.

No you can't go BT for $2k, yes spending $10k on top of the $10k you've already spent will yield you a Golf that is worth $10k or less but if you enjoyed it and you're happy nothing else matters [emoji106]

And I do love seeing v8 sports cars in my rear view mirror all the way up to 5mph over the legal speed limit where I remember I'm a Dad and should behave accordingly.


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This is why my Evo X was my favorite car. It was a nice sized car, awd, would through anything 5 star safety rating, had fantastic brakes, handling, power (though yes I had 383 whp from a little modding ) and though it wasn't as nice inside like the mk6, it was very solid, didn't have the small issues, etc. It really was a great overall car.

 

[mikejsmith1985]

This is why my Evo X was my favorite car. It was a nice sized car, awd, would through anything 5 star safety rating, had fantastic brakes, handling, power (though yes I had 383 whp from a little modding ) and though it wasn't as nice inside like the mk6, it was very solid, didn't have the small issues, etc. It really was a great overall car.

If I could have found an MR with the auto I would have had an evo instead of my GTI. No regrets here though!


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[FriggenT1]

If I could have found an MR with the auto I would have had an evo instead of my GTI. No regrets here though!


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Yeah, I can't shift gears anymore either...bad shoulder

 

[jeez]

This thread hurts my brain.

It's like:
"Hey guys, what should I do?"
Everyone- "Buy a K04 kit"
"Ok, I'll get a GTX28, same thing/price"
Everyone- "You should really go K04"
"OK, but I want the most reliability and I like bolt on stuff, how about a GTX28?"

1. We would hate for you to hurt your brain. Plenty of other threads to contribute your precious brain energy to. No one's forcing you to post in this thread.

2. You're missing the whole point of the thread. It is not necessarily about me as I've iterated before, but getting a clear view of what the options are. People are indeed running Stage 3 turbos without a Stage 3 setup, successfully.

3. Do not bitch. No good comes out of it.

 

[mikejsmith1985]

Yeah, I can't shift gears anymore either...bad shoulder

For me it's a combination of no real desire to do it and my wife refusing to learn. I enjoy driving a manual once in a while but even if I bought a track only car I'd probably still go auto, with today's technology their faster than manual and just as efficient.


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[jeez]

I think by "leaving safe power on the table" he was referring to the motor strength, not the capabilities of the K04 itself, which yes are definitely maxed out well under the magic 400HP point.

100% on point.

 

[jeez]

I agree, that is where we get into diminishing returns. I'm in the "stock turbo for life" camp anyways for the same reason. If I need more power than that, it's probably better for me to choose a different platform to begin with. Not everyone will agree, but that's where I'm at.

This thread is turning into "hey guys it should be possible to build a GTX28 kit for the price of a K04 setup, right?" If it was possible, someone would have done it already.

IMO there is nothing mind-blowing or revelatory about this thread.

Not quite. Think of a K04 kit but swap the K04 for a GTX. It is possible. There's at least one person that has done it in this thread. There are GTX28 kits out there for the 2.0 TSI for $2300. Add a tune and that's almost 3k. Not too far from an APR K04 kit that comes in at $2700. So it would end up costing similar money to a K04...but as discussed earlier, if you go down that path you should probably be less demanding about reliability and perhaps be able to do troubleshooting on your own, which I am not too comfortable with.

I would pull the trigger but the local shop which I trust, cannot guarantee fitment for a GTX mainly because they specialize and work on K04s. Which further translates into no warranty.

This thread is not about me and my car, it's about a general exploratory discussion about the options and possibilities, of something that someone very aptly called "a poor man's big turbo".

 

[jettaglis]

I'll chime in here...as to "the poor mans big turbo" he is referring to me.
Plenty hate on the ATP kit or more specifically the manifold, does it flow like crap-yes, and it tops out at 440whp with as much boost and meth you can throw at it. But that is plenty for me. Is it fast you may ask, well it's faster than ko4 with the only down side is it does not hit full boost until almost 4.5k rpms. I daily drive it 60 miles round trip and drives very normal under regular driving. To me the ko4 got boring and this fills my void that was needed.
That's all, everyone can go back to bickering.

 

[s word]

I'll chime in here...as to "the poor mans big turbo" he is referring to me.
Plenty hate on the ATP kit or more specifically the manifold, does it flow like crap-yes, and it tops out at 440whp with as much boost and meth you can throw at it. But that is plenty for me. Is it fast you may ask, well it's faster than ko4 with the only down side is it does not hit full boost until almost 4.5k rpms. I daily drive it 60 miles round trip and drives very normal under regular driving. To me the ko4 got boring and this fills my void that was needed.
That's all, everyone can go back to bickering.

ATP here too and I'd still take it over the APR K04 setup I had any day. I'd agree the K04 i got used to the GTX2867R I never get used to. Always a blast to drive...similar 60 mile commute each way daily.

 

[mikejsmith1985]

Have either of you been to the drag strip with your car?


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[jeez]

Have either of you been to the drag strip with your car?


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Since this question was posed...is it a 2867R with 0.64 or 0.86 A/R? Cause it matters for the quarter mile I'm assuming

jettaglis has a GT30 so I would expect a slower time/trap speed than a GTX28 (all else being equal). But A/R matters in any case

 

[jeez]

Also, I was under the impression the APR Stage 3 requires fueling upgrades, but I don't think this is the case. Maybe it was for the FSI?

So APR charges $5500 for a GTX2867R Kit (includes MAF, DP, DV, hoses/nuts /bolts/sparkplugs)? With a GTX2867R kit being ~$2300, that leaves $3200 for MAF, DP, DV, hoses/nuts/bolts/sparkplugs, correct?

https://www.goapr.com/products/stage3_20_tsi_trans.html#comp-box

 

[mikejsmith1985]

Also, I was under the impression the APR Stage 3 requires fueling upgrades, but I don't think this is the case. Maybe it was for the FSI?

So APR charges $5500 for a GTX2867R Kit (includes MAF, DP, DV, hoses/nuts /bolts/sparkplugs)? With a GTX2867R kit being ~$2300, that leaves $3200 for MAF, DP, DV, hoses/nuts/bolts/sparkplugs, correct?

https://www.goapr.com/products/stage3_20_tsi_trans.html#comp-box

Software is in that price too, as well as I believe 3 bar MAP sensor and the stage 3 intake unless you count that with the "hoses".


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[jeez]

Software is in that price too, as well as I believe 3 bar MAP sensor and the stage 3 intake unless you count that with the "hoses".


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Ok. Software say another $700, intake is not included according to the site. Downpipe is $750.

So...$3750 for Turbo (w Manifold)/Software/Downpipe, then another 1750 for MAF, MAP, DV, hoses/nuts/bolts/sparkplugs. Ouch APR I wish you were cheaper