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Low RPM Hesitation

smanierre

smanierre

Autocross Champion
I'm running a Cobb OTS stage 2 tune and pretty much anywhere below 2k rpm in 1st or 2nd gear, the throttle is so jerky. I will slowly press the gas and nothing will happen then all of a sudden it will jerk as if I stabbed the pedal. No matter how slowly I hit the gas it does this. Also in 1st-3rd right around 3k rpm the engine surges a bit. Anyone else experience this? Is it an issue with the tune or is it just how the cars are?
 
slowgti08

slowgti08

Ready to race!
Sounds like the tune. I had a hesitation issue around 2500-2900 which was timing being pulled due to the fuel quality used.
 
Purerock Racing

Purerock Racing

New member
I have a pretty much stock MKVI GTI, and my car also has a low rpm hesitation/surging feel to it, where the turbo does not feel smooth, it's either on, or off and stumbles at low rpm. This can't be normal? I have no error codes either. Car runs great other than this annoying hesitation...
 
MrFancypants

MrFancypants

Autocross Champion
Purerock Racing said:
I have a pretty much stock MKVI GTI, and my car also has a low rpm hesitation/surging feel to it, where the turbo does not feel smooth, it's either on, or off and stumbles at low rpm. This can't be normal? I have no error codes either. Car runs great other than this annoying hesitation...
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Unplug the throttle body and firmly plug it back in and see if that helps at all. I had this exact issue and the problem was the wiring harness (it can be repaired).
 
SnailPower

SnailPower

Autocross Newbie
Honestly, I feel this car has done it since as far back as I remember... stock and then, APR stg1, Stg2 and now K04 tune.

I hear various stories of different tunes helping it and whatnot but ultimately, I think it's with the electronic throttle lag/delay. It's almost as if it can't calculate quickly enough this lower end input.

I hate it to death because there are times where I approach a red light so I left off the gas, but then need to immediately accelerate because it turned green but have a car in front of me so I'm not trying to kill it. Upon re-tapping the gas to get going, it's a sudden jerk forward and my wife absolutely hates it. She thinks I'm the one doing it and it drives her nuts.
 
Purerock Racing

Purerock Racing

New member
SnailPower said:
Honestly, I feel this car has done it since as far back as I remember... stock and then, APR stg1, Stg2 and now K04 tune.

I hear various stories of different tunes helping it and whatnot but ultimately, I think it's with the electronic throttle lag/delay. It's almost as if it can't calculate quickly enough this lower end input.

I hate it to death because there are times where I approach a red light so I left off the gas, but then need to immediately accelerate because it turned green but have a car in front of me so I'm not trying to kill it. Upon re-tapping the gas to get going, it's a sudden jerk forward and my wife absolutely hates it. She thinks I'm the one doing it and it drives her nuts.
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same - exactly!!!! :iono:
 
sterkrazzy

sterkrazzy

Autocross Champion
SnailPower said:
I hate it to death because there are times where I approach a red light so I left off the gas, but then need to immediately accelerate because it turned green but have a car in front of me so I'm not trying to kill it. Upon re-tapping the gas to get going, it's a sudden jerk forward and my wife absolutely hates it. She thinks I'm the one doing it and it drives her nuts.
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Does that only happen when you're at really low rpms? like 800~ rpms?

My car did that pretty bad when I was apr stage 2, along with some other issues, but getting rid of apr fixed all my problems.

Sman - You're using the correct tune right? That's the only thing I can think of. If you're using the regular stage 2 tune, but running an IE intake, so you should be using the stock maf tune. If it's not that idk...

For other people, if you're running apr and have problems like this it's probably you're tune. #fuckapr
 
SnailPower

SnailPower

Autocross Newbie
sterkrazzy said:
Does that only happen when you're at really low rpms? like 800~ rpms?

My car did that pretty bad when I was apr stage 2, along with some other issues, but getting rid of apr fixed all my problems.

Sman - You're using the correct tune right? That's the only thing I can think of. If you're using the regular stage 2 tune, but running an IE intake, so you should be using the stock maf tune. If it's not that idk...

For other people, if you're running apr and have problems like this it's probably you're tune. #fuckapr
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How could APR not fix this in Stg1, Stg2, K04? Hard to imagine that. I'm pretty sure I had that stock also. I really wish I could ride in someone with a Unitronic or any tune except APR to know for sure if it's been resolved by getting rid of APR.

EDIT - Forgot, the OP has Cobb Stg2 so I can't imagine it's APR only related... So back to my original thoughts. It's simply the electronic throttle is not fast enough to calculate in real time these millisecond inputs. I'm sure it's improved on maybe the Mk7s because newer technology but we are talking technology from what? 2005 the Mk5s had this?
 
sterkrazzy

sterkrazzy

Autocross Champion
SnailPower said:
How could APR not fix this in Stg1, Stg2, K04? Hard to imagine that. I'm pretty sure I had that stock also. I really wish I could ride in someone with a Unitronic or any tune except APR to know for sure if it's been resolved by getting rid of APR.

EDIT - Forgot, the OP has Cobb Stg2 so I can't imagine it's APR only related...
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Idk if it really exists through all stages of their tune. I just know when I had apr stage 2 I had the symptoms you guys are describing. At 800 rpms, you just barely tap the gas, and the car wants to just launch away for a second. Doesn't matter if you were in 1st, 2nd, or 3rd gear. Then right around 2800-3000 rpms it had a very obvious loss of power for a second. Sometimes it would just be 1 wave of a loss of power, other times you could feel it pulse a couple times before power returned completely.

I switched to stratified and even their base file without any refinements cleared up all the issues I was having with apr.

Arin says people with problems should contact them to get it cleared up, but I'm just so sick of apr I didn't want to deal with them.

Funny part is there's plenty of people running the same tune with no problems, but then there's a handful of us that see this issue. I feel like it has to be some combination of our boxcode and revision, something like that. I'm not sure what the link is.
 
Purerock Racing

Purerock Racing

New member
I'm totally stock other than an APR Carbonio intake... the stumble is from 800 to 2000ish it seems to the worse when it's cold
 
Uberryan

Uberryan

Banned
I take it you're all DSG owners like myself? Hate to say it, but this is the initial symptoms of a wearing mechatronics unit. Low-end surging, hard upshift in low gears, and hard downshifts in low gears. Slowing down to round a turn or corner and then hitting the gas again to pick up speed is when I feel the rough shift the most, but I've also had a few instances where low throttle third gear feels like it's slipping. I just replaced the clutch packs this year, but those were bad too. Should've done the mech unit at the same time, but the car literally feels like garbage when I drive it. Ready to replace it finally.



The solution is a new mech unit, but I would recommend clutch packs while you're in there since a faulty mech unit will have damaging impacts on the CPs. Would be great if that old recall from the MKVs got pushed up to the MK6s since VW simply cannot get this right.
 
sterkrazzy

sterkrazzy

Autocross Champion
Idk, I have a manual and I've felt some of the things talked about here. Like the way Snail described his problems is exactly what I've felt in my car. The jerking forward problem he mentioned drove me crazy until I just said fuck it and changed tuners. You didn't even have to be in gear to notice the problem. I could put it in neutral and try to just barely tap the gas as light as possible and the rpms would jump up to 1200 rpms. Now imagine the rpms jumping up like that every time you're in gear around 800 rpms and you get that annoying jerk.
 
smanierre

smanierre

Autocross Champion
I'm manual as well and yea, I'm on the stock maf tune. I'm hoping the stratified tune will clear up at least some of it when I get it. I think mine may also have something to do with the clutch install, after that something just seemed off. Clutch engaging when the pedal is halfway up, inconsistent engagements, shudder when starting in first. Eventually I plan on a new trans so I'll do the install myself so I know it's actually right

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
 
Purerock Racing

Purerock Racing

New member
I'm manual trans also, and my clutch seems to be working perfectly, it's definitely not the trans or clutch. Its the throttle position boost sensor or something that gives a signal to the turbo or not, and at 1000-2000 rpm t's like the turbo it totally confused and doesn't work smoothly... I like my car too but this surging thing make me hate! I shouldn't have to mash the throttle down all the time.
 
SnailPower

SnailPower

Autocross Newbie
Purerock Racing said:
I'm manual trans also, and my clutch seems to be working perfectly, it's definitely not the trans or clutch. Its the throttle position boost sensor or something that gives a signal to the turbo or not, and at 1000-2000 rpm t's like the turbo it totally confused and doesn't work smoothly... I like my car too but this surging thing make me hate! I shouldn't have to mash the throttle down all the time.
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Welcome to what I believe is the electronic throttle control causing the issue. You have to remember these cars are on older technology compared to lets say the Mk7s. There is just a delay/lag for it to read the input fast enough of what you are trying to do. A tune can only do so much. In fact a lot of people feel immediately after their tune, the issues are resolved, only to drive it around enough, the car re-learns and is back to the same slug pit that they were in at the beginning...

In this aspect, I wish I was back on mechanical. The immediate feeling of your input is sorely missed. Whether you were going to blow your engine for doing something wrong or not, but at least it would react instant of whatever the heck you did.

That is ultimately why DSG for this car is a few milliseconds quicker because of the sore excuse of a manual that this car really is due to the electronics. :thumbdown:
 
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