Edward Snowden still a hero on this board?

[KYGTIGuy]

This is where i differ - i am willing to sacrifice my own safety to protect our constitution. That said, our constitution only offers protection for American citizens so spy away on everyone else.

This.

If you aren't a US citizen....watch your ass

 

[Do Work Son]

I agree. However, when people are upset the US spies on foreign leaders and think this is new, they are being naive or just trying to score points at securities expense.

Of course it's not new but foreign pressure to reign in the NSA's domestic spying (calling a spade a spade) might be worth it.


Sent from my iPhone 5s - the world's greatest smartphone - so I am clearly better than you and whatever pitiful excuse for a communications device you use.

 

[DHS]

Snowden is a traitor

I can not discuss this much, but he should be shot.

 

[Bender1]

What are your reasons for disagreeing? I believe you said you're in security? I'd love to hear your take and/or ideas

This is a funny area for me and I admit right off the bat that I will voice some contradictions here.

First - anything can be secured. Period.
Second - securing anything has a cost. This cost is both financial and practical. Schools are a great example. If i were to peg current school security at a percentage I would put it at about 40%. To get it to 80% is pretty cost effective and has little practical impact. To get to 100% would be massively expensive and would have horrible practical impacts (think strip searches for kids).

Now, what you reference in terms of using security devices to prevent crimes...

Public spaces change the calculus. You cannot secure a public space through devices. Devices in a public spaces do not stop crime. Devices provide excellent evidentiary sources but not without compromises. That camera that is on the corner might be great at capturing who stole a car, but at the same time it captures EVERYTHING else that we hold private and dear. Sit on the bench with your girlfriend? Play basketball with your buddies? Pick your nose at the stop light? None of this is relevant yet it is all captured, stored, and analyzed. This is not the behavior of a healthy society.

 

[Do Work Son]

There are people collecting all that data, fallible people, with vices, temptations, and issues just like the rest of us potential criminals. I simply don't trust those collectors because they wear an NSA badge like the government expects us to.


Sent from my iPhone 5s - the world's greatest smartphone - so I am clearly better than you and whatever pitiful excuse for a communications device you use.

 

[KYGTIGuy]

There are people collecting all that data, fallible people, with vices, temptations, and issues just like the rest of us potential criminals. I simply don't trust those collectors because they wear an NSA badge like the government expects us to.


Sent from my iPhone 5s - the world's greatest smartphone - so I am clearly better than you and whatever pitiful excuse for a communications device you use.

Not to change the topic but this is what confuses my about death penalty supporters. They say they don't want the government gathering all that info because the people who gather it are imperfect but if the government wants to kill citizens, they're cool with that.

What's worse? The government knowing who picks their noses at stop lights or the government killing you?

I say both are unacceptable.

I digress.

 

[Do Work Son]

Not a fan of the death penalty either but human element taints every judgement call. It's a slippery slope but when it comes to mass data collection I'm particularly reticent.

I went to college with a really smart guy from Pakistan and exchanged emails with him concerning terrorism and its effects on Muslim society here in the US. That was done from my gmail account in 2004-5 so now my emails (and contact list) are subject to NSA collection because I communicated with a foreigner about terrorism. The text had all the buzzwords: suicide bombing, targeting, assassination, IEDs, etc so I have no doubt my emails are sitting in a server somewhere awaiting analytics.


Sent from my iPhone 5s - the world's greatest smartphone - so I am clearly better than you and whatever pitiful excuse for a communications device you use.

 

[zrickety]

That's why I think Snowden is a good guy. He brought this stuff to light, we all assume they are listening but to see the extent of it in black and white, people start to notice. I'm tired of every administration (Bush, Obama, everybody) sweeping this stuff under the rug and telling us it's for our own good. I wouldn't say they are afraid of amending the constitution, if anything they may have amended it too much.
The problem is the courts are being bought just like these incumbent politicians. Few of them represent the average American anymore.

 

[Saabstory]

The text had all the buzzwords: suicide bombing, targeting, assassination, IEDs, etc so I have no doubt my emails are sitting in a server somewhere awaiting analytics.

Reported for buzzwords

 

[Bender1]

I went to college with a really smart guy from Pakistan and exchanged emails with him concerning terrorism and its effects on Muslim society here in the US. That was done from my gmail account in 2004-5 so now my emails (and contact list) are subject to NSA collection because I communicated with a foreigner about terrorism. The text had all the buzzwords: suicide bombing, targeting, assassination, IEDs, etc so I have no doubt my emails are sitting in a server somewhere awaiting analytics.

.

Your emails with him WERE, they are not any more.

 

[KYGTIGuy]

Not a fan of the death penalty either but human element taints every judgement call. It's a slippery slope but when it comes to mass data collection I'm particularly reticent.

I went to college with a really smart guy from Pakistan and exchanged emails with him concerning terrorism and its effects on Muslim society here in the US. That was done from my gmail account in 2004-5 so now my emails (and contact list) are subject to NSA collection because I communicated with a foreigner about terrorism. The text had all the buzzwords: suicide bombing, targeting, assassination, IEDs, etc so I have no doubt my emails are sitting in a server somewhere awaiting analytics.


Sent from my iPhone 5s - the world's greatest smartphone - so I am clearly better than you and whatever pitiful excuse for a communications device you use.

Yeah but Bush was president then and republicans didnt care. In fact, you were an asshole for siding with the enemy if you protested.

 

[Do Work Son]

Yeah but Bush was president then and republicans didnt care. In fact, you were an asshole for siding with the enemy if you protested.

I still want to know just how much of PRISM was explained to those elected officials who approved it.

 

[KYGTIGuy]

I still want to know just how much of PRISM was explained to those elected officials who approved it.

I agree.

Not to change subjects again but I always laugh when people point to Democrats voting for the Iraq War. They voted based on the cherry picked intel they were given by the Bush Admin.

Point is, voting for something doesnt mean you approve of how its then used by the admin. PRISM or Iraq war.


Nuance is too much for most people, doe.