Final decision on brakes for Track Day

[legandrex]

After several hours of searching and advice from a few, I am going to make a few purchases for one or two track days I hope to attend this fall. Looking for some feedback on what I plan to do.

First, I have little experience other than I am 37 and have been driving a performance type car most of my driving years. I have done touring on Road America several times which has allowed me to take corners at a good clip and reach over 100mph on several occassions while closing the gap so to speak. I got the bug and want to do a few track days...maybe one at Blackhawk and one at Road America before the snow flies.

My GTI is stock at this time(pirelli all seasons) and I intend to drive in novice group pushing it at a 7/10's pace or so max.

Here is what I plan to do and tell me if it is necessary or not.

1. Helmet-looking at a basic Zamp JA-2 open face helmet(meets requirements)-decent helmet or should I spend more money for something better?
2. Stoptech Street Performance pad replacement for front and rear
3. Fluid Change-not sure if to go with ATE Super Blue or Motul 600 fluid-don't really want to have to flush more than once a year so.
4. USP stainless lines-necessary?

Work will be performed at a CarX a friend of mine owns so labor is free.

My budget is limited so my decisions are keeping that in mind, perfect world I would have summer tires, BBK, change fluid day after, etc. but can't swing it with two little ones, a mortgage, wife...you know the drill.

I just want to have fun, be safe, and not kill myself or the car.

Thanks in advance.

 

[RacingManiac]

Pad and fluid as a minimum for a track day. I've heard good things about the Stop Tech pads so its probably not a bad pick(especially on stock tires). Down the line you might look into track compound pads at least for the front, maybe even a dedicated set of rotors to use with that pad. Stainless line is not necessary but doesn't hurt to have. You really only need one helmet for maybe 5-10 years as most organization will let you run at least 1 generation older if not 2. So no reason not to get the latest cert one if not too much money. $150-$200 can get you a 2010 helmet.

Nicer tires would make it more enjoyable, as it also make the ESP less active. But no reason not to kill off the stock tires....

Road America might be pretty hard on brake, better make use of those straights to make sure your brake pedals are still there after some hot laps...

 

[troyguitar]

RA shouldn't be that bad on brakes, lots of looooong straights to cool things down. I could be wrong though, I have not driven a regular car there.

When are there Blackhawk track days this fall? I would love to hit one. I have only been there once and it was before they repaved it, 2001 or 2002 and I really liked the track.

 

[Gunkata]

RA is the hardest track on brakes I've ever run, imho - because of the long straights and hauling a car down from 130-150mph+

 

[FLtrooper]

Invest in a Full Face helmet... It is not much warmer!

 

[RacingManiac]

RA shouldn't be that bad on brakes, lots of looooong straights to cool things down. I could be wrong though, I have not driven a regular car there.

When are there Blackhawk track days this fall? I would love to hit one. I have only been there once and it was before they repaved it, 2001 or 2002 and I really liked the track.

The issue is I think they are 120-130+ MPH stop I think. Not many track you can hit those speed on a road car, and you do it probably 3 times a lap...

 

[troyguitar]

and indeed I must have been wrong, that is what happens when you try to apply kart experience to street cars :lol:

IIRC my shifter averaged 95ish around RA (2:30 or so lap times) with a top speed of 110, very easy on the brakes.

 

[RacingManiac]

Kart probably gets better cooling on those exposed discs too... You probably don't slow down as much for some of those corners vs the cars....I don't think I have the balls to do that...lol

2:30 is pretty fast isn't it? I think LMP cars runs 1:50 ish?

 

[troyguitar]

RA is really one of the slowest tracks for karts relative to cars, it is just too fast. You are at top speed pushing against the air for something like 50% of each lap :lol: On most other tracks we usually destroy anything short of a purpose built race car - Blackhawk times were something like 1:10 I believe. RA is still a lot of fun to race though, last time I was there we had 80-100 karts on the track and 10-20 in the lead draft the whole race.

That being said, I'd still like to take the GTI out at Blackhawk and see just how slow it is with stock wheels and tires :lol:

 

[Gunkata]

GTI is pretty quick on a course like Blackhawk or Gingerman even stock - that torque helps!

 

[RacingManiac]

Off topic, Grattan in 2 weeks....can't wait...

Though now I am thinking to run Sat again as if I do I can still do autoX locally on Sun...

 

[Gunkata]

boo^... I'll only be doing sunday

 

[jmk0071]

After several hours of searching and advice from a few, I am going to make a few purchases for one or two track days I hope to attend this fall. Looking for some feedback on what I plan to do.

First, I have little experience other than I am 37 and have been driving a performance type car most of my driving years. I have done touring on Road America several times which has allowed me to take corners at a good clip and reach over 100mph on several occassions while closing the gap so to speak. I got the bug and want to do a few track days...maybe one at Blackhawk and one at Road America before the snow flies.

My GTI is stock at this time(pirelli all seasons) and I intend to drive in novice group pushing it at a 7/10's pace or so max.

Here is what I plan to do and tell me if it is necessary or not.

1. Helmet-looking at a basic Zamp JA-2 open face helmet(meets requirements)-decent helmet or should I spend more money for something better?
2. Stoptech Street Performance pad replacement for front and rear
3. Fluid Change-not sure if to go with ATE Super Blue or Motul 600 fluid-don't really want to have to flush more than once a year so.
4. USP stainless lines-necessary?

Work will be performed at a CarX a friend of mine owns so labor is free.

My budget is limited so my decisions are keeping that in mind, perfect world I would have summer tires, BBK, change fluid day after, etc. but can't swing it with two little ones, a mortgage, wife...you know the drill.

I just want to have fun, be safe, and not kill myself or the car.

Thanks in advance.

Here are my thoughts:

1. Assuming safety is important to you, get a closed face helmet. Here is a basic Bell Helmet, a quality product, on sale for $259: http://www.infmotorsports.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BEL-20101

2. I have no experience with Stop Tech pads. However, I have had good experience with EBC Yellow Stuff for the street and track when the dust sheilds are removed and with quality brake fluid. (More on this later...) The EBC Yellows are loud at first on the street but after one track day, they will be very quiet on the street thereafter.

3. Especially for Blackhawk and Road American, I would definitely get Motul RBF 600 or better. I spent $70 on SRF Fluid which is probably overkill for your application, although Blackhawk is brutal on fluid. Motul is much less.

4. I don't think SS lines are necessary, especially if you are just starting out (assuming your oem lines are in good shape). I've tracked for over two years without them and been fine. That said, it is a good idea.

IMPORTANT: I highly recommend that you, and anyone else who tracks their cars, remove the front dust shields. The best evidence I can give on this is what happened to me when I ran Gingerman with and without dust shields. The first time, in 70 degree weather, with EBC Yellow pads (and Motul 600), I had brake fade within 2 laps. I pulled in after the third lap which was for cool down. When i got out, major smoke was coming out of my pads. Two years later, I ran Gingerman in near 90 degree weather, without dust shields, same pads (and SRF Fluid). Although I was running much harder, with stickier tires and much hotter weather, I had absolutely no fade after much longer sessions. Did the SRF fluid help? Maybe. But the biggest difference was no dust sheilds. Assuming anyone does this, make sure to wrap you surrounding components with heat reflective tape.

Lastly, a proper brake set up at Blackhawk and RA is critically important but for different reasons. Without getting into the technical aspects, I believe you are more likely to get brake fade at Blackhawk but the consequences of brake fade at Road American would likely be much worse. Either way, don't mess around with your brakes--particularly at these tracks.

Best of luck...

 

[TXBDan]

Street pads are not track pads. They may get you by for the first event or two, but they'll be a waste of money soon after. It's not worth risking at best your paid time on track and at worst your life because youre brakes aren't up to snuff. At least get real track front pads and use the StopTechs for rears.

You need track brake fluid. I like ATE Type 200 (Gold)

HJC has some nice cheaper helmets. Check out Apexperformance.net. Really great company. Ask if there are any coupon codes floating around and you'll likely get 10-20% off. You can get your helmet and fluid there.

If you decide you want track pads, i'm selling some Hawk HTC-60s for $120. I'm not trying to spam, if you don't get mine, get SOME track pads.

 

[troyguitar]

But the biggest difference was no dust sheilds. Assuming anyone does this, make sure to wrap you surrounding components with heat reflective tape.

What exactly would you tape and why - couldn't you just clean the dust off at the end of the day?